Race

[Fanta]

Okay remember don't just debate what i have said below but the whole race issue. Don't let it be in the cheese bin thike my other debates because you turned them into stupid bitching matches:


You'll all probably hate me for saying this but i can't stand the black attitude. I am genralising because not all black people are like this but they are rasist idiots who think its cool to talk like a complete fool, walk like a retard. and just genrally be a complete pillock. I used to stick up for black and asian communities but am finding more and more that they don't deserve it. they are racist trouble making degnuts who think its cool to take drugs/ be a drug dealer, be a pimp, carry guns, be a criminal, and have bugger all respect for women.

Try not to hate me for saying this but it's just what i have noticed and again it is not all black people. infact many white people have this attitude and i hate it. my opinion ok.

[PoofBird]

Originally posted by Fanta
my opinion ok.

no. not ok.

You say you have noticed it's not all black people (very observant, millions in africa are too hungry to be pimps :rolleyes: ), and you have noticed that a lot of white people have that attitude too.

You yourself have deduced that is not a racial matter. It's ok to not like those people. That is an opinion.

You should however, not make it sound like it's about race, and call this thread "race" because that is very ignorant, offensive, stupid and utterly wrong.

now go play outside.

[Fanta]

no. it is about race though. it is the black attitude. dumb white kids just copied it. but i mostly said that so people wouldn't call me a racist bitch... and my message kind of changed during my writting it so sorry it doesn't exactly match the title sir. If you don't like it then may i change the title to black attitude or something?

Another thing. i hate the way you aren't even allowed to argue with a black person. You will be called racist. Why!? I mean just because you fight with a black person and your white does not make it race related at all byt thats not what they (the black person) will say and who will everyone believe? ..... yes the black person.

again don't hate me and yes i am genralising again.

[PoofBird]

Originally posted by Fanta
yes i am genralising again.

why generalize at all?

If you say you are generalizing, that means you know the issue is more complicated than you make it seem.
At the same time you are afraid to be called a racist.

why don't you just stop generalizing?

[Fanta]

i have to genralise. as not all people are the same. i don't want to have to talk about each and every black person in the world idividually:rolleyes:

[moog]

So people are not all the same, you say. Why then do you describe it as a 'black attitude'?

If you're going to make a valid argument, try putting some thought in it first

[cadex]

but pimps are :cool:




ps.


bring my money

[Fanta]

Originally posted by the colonel
So people are not all the same, you say. Why then do you describe it as a 'black attitude'?

If you're going to make a valid argument, try putting some thought in it first

err *knock knock* i explained that. Probably not very well. But i just can't be arse to explain again. BTW it needs a name.

Cadex pimps are not cool. Well i don't think so. i think you are a sad twat with 'black attitude'

[almighty_bob]

why is it that if a 'white' kid makes a 'racist' comment to a 'black' kid in a school, it is written and recorded, it will follow them for life
however, if a 'black' kid makes an equally 'racist' comment to a 'white' kid, it is not recorded?

why is it that government officials state;
'it is not racist if a 'coloured' person makes a comment about the race of a 'white''

[scram]

Sesame Street today was bought to you by the letters W, T and F.

Listen, no offense but you clearly don't understand how to make this argument. Racism is a sensitive issue at the best of times and the way you are making your argument is quite confusing and hypocritical - it also makes you seem racist.

I'm sure the point you are trying to make is that you don't like the attitude adopted by a lot of teens and young adults which is characterised by the "black gangsta" stereotype. Fair enough.

I still don't think its much of a debate topic.

[PoofBird]

pimp attitude DOES NOT EQUAL black attitude

some blacks are pimps, but it's not because they are black.

continue to say such things, and I will consider you a racist.
officially.

[Fanta]

Originally posted by Scrambled
Sesame Street today was bought to you by the letters W, T and F.

Listen, no offense but you clearly don't understand how to make this argument. Racism is a sensitive issue at the best of times and the way you are making your argument is quite confusing and hypocritical - it also makes you seem racist.

I'm sure the point you are trying to make is that you don't like the attitude adopted by a lot of teens and young adults which is characterised by the "black gangsta" stereotype. Fair enough.

I still don't think its much of a debate topic.

If its not much of a debate topic then why are you debating the topic?

[Fanta]

sorry i have to go do something with a point now. later...

[cadex]

Originally posted by Fanta
i think you are a sad twat with 'black attitude'


:'(


take that dagger out my back.


oh, and stop being racist or you'll get band.

[almighty_bob]

instead of flaming, anyone care to discuss my lil question???

[Fanta]

poof its not just the pimp thing its all the other stuff too. call me racist. i guess i am. but they turned me that way. i used to stick up for them.

[cadex]

them?


you talk like they are all one thing, and one thing only.


some white people are good, some are evil.
some black people are good, some are evil.
some asian people...etc


it varies from one person to another.

[scram]

Originally posted by almighty_bob
instead of flaming, anyone care to discuss my lil question???

No

and Fanta? I wasnt debating your topic. I was giving you a better way to put it and telling you that you can't debate for shit. If I was debating it I would give my opinions on it.

As it turns out, I didn't.

[almighty_bob]

individuals do different things, but we all brand;which we shouldnt...

instead of bickering.... care to discuss my question

<discussing/ debating is different to answering; ok scrambled...>

[Reddig]

I actually do understand Fanta's point, although i don't agree with it.

First of all, where I live I see a black person not more than once or twice a week. There are more asians arround, but I have totaly no feelings pro or agains them - they just are + they have chinese/viet/tai fast food bars, which i like a lot. There is a bunch of arabs, and they have kebab bars, which are even better :D. But since i see very few blacks, i personaly know only one, and there are about five of them, who appear in Polish kultural/political life i can't say anything about them what i would take out of my own experience.

The point is, i know blacks a lot. Where from you ask? Well that's obvious - from tv, movies, music. That gives you a very clear picture of how a black looks like: rap, gangsta, guns, gold chains, being cool, all that shit. I know this is not true, but this is an image we're being sold, no wonder there are such stereotypes.


Finally I'm rather don't like the thing I'll call "regresive racism" - that a white blond blue eyed wealthy guy is generally on a lost position when confronting a black lesbian konfucionist called Fernandez, because she gets five points for being "different". I understand, that racism is a bad thing, but hey, let's not exaturate.

[squealpiggy]

The reason for that is that black people are a minority in a country which has had a history of persecuting them. It was in my lifetime that Enoch Powell made his "rivers of blood" speech, the BNP is gaining power etc etc. It is changing around now though so that racial motivation is being applied to crimes committed by non whites, but asking "Why aren't black people treated the same as white people in regards to racism?" well why not ask the question "Why aren't black people treated the same as white people by the police or in court etc?".

I don't tend to see skin colour. Yes there are certain black people who believe that the colour of their skin intimidates white people and there are some white people who allow this to happen. But if you are confronted by a gang of scallies/neds/charvers whatever does it really matter if they're black or white? they're intimidating anyway.

[Fanta]

Finally your debating properly. i wasn't just asking you to debate my point but the whole race issue...

anywho i don't just get my opinion of blacks off the TV but the way they are to me. i am sick of sticking up for them.

yes i assosiate them as one thing type thingy but this is because i genralised and can't be arsed to be politically correct.

[Bobbo]

When I was actually alive I found that the weternized negro who came from a challenged socio-economic background bought into pop culture hook, line and sinker. Pop culture; that wonderful jiggly-puff that makes you wear your baseball cap all crazy and put your jeans on backwards. The real culprit here is pop-culture.......Which is total crap.

I am annoyed with all of the press and media that black, homosexual, asian or whatever crippled up half-wit group that has some bitch gets. A big fat fuck-all to it from me.

From the idiotic sport commentators, to the affirmative action camp. From the spoon fed pap of racial sexual misconceptions to the microcephalic thugs that seem to do their level best to popularize a racial stance. It's all crap.

Point of fact; 1 out of 6 African American males will spend at least 1 year of their lives behind bars. 1 out of 9 will be the victim or antagonist of a violent crime. 1 out of 14 will partake in that happy pastime called rape. The African American (male or female)is 20 times more likely to have H.I.V. then any other nationality. I am not talking about naturalized citizens.

We have been twenty plus years into affirmative action and yet the United States still has 5th and 6th generation African American welfare families. The thing with stereotypes is that there are reasons to make a generalization otherwise we wouldn't have them.



Anyway.......I am a zombie and I prefer white meat to dark anyday.

[PoofBird]

bobbo,

mr bobbo,

You can spell. You know difficult words such as microcephalic. You know numbers and statistics.

Therefore, you could be a fine debate partner (more so than Fanta, who just blurps out ignorance)


Are you, in fact, saying that the african american's tendancy to be involved in crime, hiv, being behind bars, committing rape, is in any way related to the fact that they are black?

If so, you are saying there is a racial, even a genetic, cause to crime, murder, rape and filth.

If not, what is your frigging point?


Yes, 5th and 6th generation... but only halfway the last century could a black woman choose a place to sit in a fucking bus!
People in welfare are people in welfare!
If they choose to stay in there, you can say that is wrong. But it's not because they're black! There are a trillions of other factors.
Are you saying (and you sure are implying) that being black holds a tendency to stay in welfare and be satisfied with getting the taxpayers money?

How in the hell is that cause by race?

[squealpiggy]

Exactly what poofbird said, these statistics can be cause by black people being hostile to society, or they can be caused by society being hostile to black people. There is more race related crime in paces where there is more segregation. There is a little race related crime in the UK, not really in the big cities but in the sattelite towns. Race crime is a huge problem in the states, but not so much in Canada where a city like Toronto is the most multicultural on earth. Crime does happen but in any society crime is caused by the disaffected. You don't really get many sons of dentists going out and mugging someone, but you will get that from poorer backgrounds.

Black people tend to be poorer due to stereotypes like yours, and the poverty perpetuates the behaviour which perpetuates the stereotype.

[Fanta]

i dont blurp out ignorance. i can't help not being bright or explaining myself properly i do try...

[squealpiggy]

Just think about your opinions. If everyone thought about their opinions before putting them into practise the world would be a far nicer place.

[Fanta]

i have thought about my opinions. why do you all want to tell me how to think? this thread has gone stupid. it's here for you to debate race. it wasn't for you just to debate what i said. although i didn't explain that....

[squealpiggy]

If your argument is "that's my opinion" then my argument is "you are wrong". We're not exactly going to cover any ground with that.

[Fanta]

But it is my opinion. it's certainly no fact that i think the black attitude if fucking stupid. if thats what we are talking about - coz the topics keep getting messend up.

[squealpiggy]

First of all what is "black attitude"? Secondly why is it stupid?

[Fanta]

'black attitude' is where people think they are the greatest peron in the world, they speak incorrectly on purpose, walk rather retarded, dress like a two year old trying to dress itself, rediculous slang, think its cool to bunk off school all the time, horribly rude, have no respect for women, think its cool to be a criminal and carry guns and be a pimp and a drug dealer. - You know that kind of thing. sorry can't list it all would be here for days.

[Fanta]

Originally posted by Pinkerbell
I hate to say this, but I know the "attitude" you are talking about. But it's not fair to say it's a "black" attitude, because there are LOTS of people that act like this, and you shouldn't have titled the thread "race." It has nothing at all to do with race, but more to do with intelligence and maturity. These people who act like this don't have either one. Maybe if you would stop saying it's a "black thing", everyone would get off your back because it does make you sound like a narrow-minded fool when you say it's because of race.

i have explained this before i called it the black attitude as that is where it oringinated besides it needs a name.

this thread is for all issues on race (read 1st post) not just my argument - which is not strictly to do with race i suppose but like i adi before what i was saying just kind of changed as i was typing it and i didn't know how to change the title.

[Mr. Moo]

Omg what an admirable post Pinkerbell. Fanta, I suggest you read it through 100 times.

Edit: Right, well thanks for making my post sound retarded by posting 2 seconds before me.

[Fanta]

Originally posted by Pinkerbell
Just stop. Now.

No. this is where it came from. black people will admit it i expect - just not in the negative sense. Infact black people are sometime riddiculed bby other black people for not acting this way. ok so i got that of the prince of belair mostly but i am pretty sure it is true. they are proud of being black which is fair enough but now seem to think that this 'black attitude' is part of their culture which it isn't. if i carry on my message will get confused but basicly if they don't have the attitude then i would like black people but i have never met one without it. this is why i no longer stick up for them and say its just skin colour.

[notmarcie]

I am so sick of white peoples attitudes. They all dress like Gap adverts and drive SUVs and people carriers, they drink red wine all the time. They also beat up their wives and sexually abuse kids,. Even their church leaders abuse kids. They all look the same, and talk with these really stupid voices, they go to university to learn big words to make them sound clever. They think they are so good because they read the Guardian. They all live in apartments with wooden floors and rugs on the floors. And they all shop at Ikea.



See how stupid it is to apply a stereotype to a group of people based on skin colour.

As for saying black and Asian communities are racist and drug dealers and carry guns. I do hope you have statistics to back this up. Not personal experience, but hard facts from somewhere like the Home Office or the FBI showing all non white communities are like this and white communities are never like this.

Bobbo said
Point of fact; 1 out of 6 African American males will spend at least 1 year of their lives behind bars. 1 out of 9 will be the victim or antagonist of a violent crime. 1 out of 14 will partake in that happy pastime called rape. The African American (male or female)is 20 times more likely to have H.I.V. then any other nationality. I am not talking about naturalized citizens. Do you have statistics to show the level of criminality of white Americans ? How do you account for the fact that there are 5th and 6th generation white families who are still in poverty ? I mean they can't even blame it on slavery !

[notmarcie]

There is a huge difference between culture and attitude. You wouldn't say Australian people and Norwegian people have the same culture and attitude so why apply it to black people.

Your debate has no solid basis, as advised before, just stop. You are digging into a deeper hole here

[Fanta]

I am so sick of white peoples attitudes. They all dress like Gap adverts and drive SUVs and people carriers, they drink red wine all the time. They also beat up their wives and sexually abuse kids,. Even their church leaders abuse kids. They all look the same, and talk with these really stupid voices, they go to university to learn big words to make them sound clever. They think they are so good because they read the Guardian. They all live in apartments with wooden floors and rugs on the floors. And they all shop at Ikea.

I was not saying it about black people but the black attitude. we al look the same? yes i think chris evans looks just like the queen don't you? but to most of that lol.


See how stupid it is to apply a stereotype to a group of people based on skin colour.

No most of its true in both cases. btw like i have explained in loads of other posts i am genralising. as many white people have this attitude it just happened to originate from blacks. i think maybe they turned hostile because white pople were horrible to them but thats doesn't really happen anymore.

As for saying black and Asian communities are racist and drug dealers and carry guns. I do hope you have statistics to back this up. Not personal experience, but hard facts from somewhere like the Home Office or the FBI showing all non white communities are like this and white communities are never like this.

In future read things properly please. i said people with the 'black attitude' think its cool to carry guns etc.

Note: Could people read things through before replying please? i am just repeating myself...

[Fanta]

There is a huge difference between culture and attitude. You wouldn't say Australian people and Norwegian people have the same culture and attitude so why apply it to black people.

i know i am the one that stated in is not their culture. Same goes for you read things through properly please.

[felp]

Okay Fanta, you're digging a deap hole, becareful and possibly quit while you can still dig your way out (no, no, dig up stoopid).

I understand where he/she is comming from though. But I think he/she is a little confused, wording wise. I don't think she means this "attitute" has anything to do with race (note the word think, good, note it again and possibly again).
For clarity I will invent a word I call "Bruvva" Now bruvva is basically this "black attitude" he/she was talking about with one huge exception, it's not JUST black, in fact, here in auz the only people who can afford to be "Bruvvas" are 15-17 yearold nerds, who think dressing like fools and pretending they're black and listenting to the loudest possible "gangsta" rap will make them not only cool, but tough.
This Bruvva problem is in almost every part of the western world. It really isn't accurate to credit it to black race, because it is really American, and last time i checked the majority of black people were located in Africa, you do know where Africa is correct?
Another problem with race (here) is that many people see the Aboriginals (also black) as lazy petoral sniffing bumbs, and the funny thing is that I met an aboriginal that came from working in the country, he came here and he tells me "I am ashamed of the way the Aboriginals are represented here! Look at most of them (he points out side to a few that are begging) They make the rest of us look bad" And this sadly is the case. These beggers are in the minority (as are the black Bruvvas), however thanks to the media's amazing method of generalising and ignorance, the only groups that get attention are either the bruvvas or the beggers. This is why people like Fanta generalise here, because the media makes it seem like the majourity of the race is this one way. Once we get past this immage however we learn that many people from different races are forced to work harder, why? because they are scared that people will think of them in the way they are presented in the media. I am from an Italian background and if you look at the way we are presented in Aussie media it's scary for me. I am therefore always worried that when I go for the job interview this person will assume I am one of those crack sniffing, club going excess gell using car doof doofing wogs that cant shpeak properly. This is also why racism from a white person to a black, asian or musilm is to be much worse then other. And whilst I don't think it should be seen as worse, it doesn't really matter, because 9 times out of 10 your employer will be a little cracker himself (yes I said himself, not because I believe employers should be male, but because they usually are).

Now I must admit that there is little in the way of fact with what i have written, most of it is just oppinon based on experience, which i cant say ive had a lot of, so yes I'm not the best person to argue this topic, but i thought I should clear a few things up.

Oh and about my spelling i will go back and edit this post tomorrow - if i may (and yes this is the last time i will make a post and then appologise about my spelling, i imagine it's starting to annoy anyone who reads my posts now).

[Amazing Morris]

I don't think race has anything to do with attitude.
Yes sometimes cultures are notorious for doing things that some people don't agree with but why the hell should we be boxed with our race, sex, lifestyle choice and cultural background. The truth is some people are stupid pillocks and some people aren't and the other 99% of people are somewhere in between and it doesn't matter what race you are.

[Fanta]

Felp
i'll have to give it to you you are probably right. Not that i could be arsed to read it all. but yeah.

And you did not blow everything i said out of proportion like most other people have done :D. I guess you read things through :) and don't say i am saying one thing when i was infact saying something else.

[notmarcie]

This is possibly the most pointless debate ever as one side is incredibly lop sided and not offering any argument other than this is my opinion.

Fanta I am not having a go, but your idea are unformed and so people aren't having a go at you, but your unformed debate.

I feel you have missed the point of this entirely and are taking other people suggests personally when all they are asking is that you modify the debate and appreciate its not black attitude, its just a bad attitude that has nothing to do with skin colour

[Fanta]

Originally posted by notmarcie
This is possibly the most pointless debate ever as one side is incredibly lop sided and not offering any argument other than this is my opinion.

Fanta I am not having a go, but your idea are unformed and so people aren't having a go at you, but your unformed debate.

I feel you have missed the point of this entirely and are taking other people suggests personally when all they are asking is that you modify the debate and appreciate its not black attitude, its just a bad attitude that has nothing to do with skin colour

as i have explained i call it the black attitude as it needs a name and that is where it originated from. it has little to do with skin colour now though i will agree. but as i said what i was saying kind of changed after me putting the title. i wanted to change it but... anywho this thread was for all issues of race...

people are just having a go at me. most of the pople here are here just to gang up on people. sorry noone gets my debate but if you don't like it fuck off. and i am still going to call it 'black attitude' no matter what anyone says.

BTW how do i get a picture in my signature? do you know?

[Fanta]

Originally posted by Pinkerbell
*fucks off* I don't get your debate. And I don't get how you can be so narrow minded. You keep calling it that if you want to, but don't be surprised if you never have many friends.

i do have friends. NOw may we get back to the subject of race rather than the apparent lameness of my posts? The issue is things related to race not how much you all hate me.

how do i get a picture in my signature?

[felp]

Originally posted by Fanta
how do i get a picture in my signature?

because I feel sorry for you (guys i really don't think she's trying to sound racist or be racist, i think she just has different wording to us all) I will tell you.
In your profile you have a little area for sigs, you attach the img tags (see the little code link next to it for more details on how to attach the tags) and put in a url of which there is the picture. To get a url, you must have the pic hosted on a server, there are some free things around search google for free hoasting if you don't have any. :)

---edit
just so i don't make a useless post I have PM'd you with more instructions and so forth, any other help you need can be done through this method, that way it doesnt side track the thread and annoy other people... I hope. ;)

[Fanta]

[QUOTE]
because I feel sorry for you (guys i really don't think she's trying to sound racist or be racist, i think she just has different wording to us all) I will tell you.

Yes it's worded terribly however if i was saying it it would probably make more sense.


In your profile you have a little area for sigs, you attach the img tags (see the little code link next to it for more details on how to attach the tags) and put in a url of which there is the picture. To get a url, you must have the pic hosted on a server, there are some free things around search google for free hoasting if you don't have any. :)

but i tried putting on image tags and it didn't work it just had the tags and the code in writting? err this shouldn't really be in this debate anyway. erm. ah ha ha it's not working :(

[squealpiggy]

I didn't get your opinion either, can you swear at me too?

[Fanta]

Originally posted by squealpiggy
I didn't get your opinion either, can you swear at me too?

If you like, fuck face :)

Now ahem back to the debate of race please. lets just forget the crapness of my debating and disscuss race issues. that or go away :)

[Mr. Moo]

I think this issue really isn't a good topic to be debating. If you have any opinions about matters such as racism, facism, sexism, anythingelseism, then it's best to just keep your thoughts to yourself.
Discussing things like this is usually something that loses you respect.

This guy was a friend of mine who lost so much respect it was unbelievable.
http://moposite.com/mopolauta/viewtopic.php?t=1594

Edit: Btw, the Chris Penrose guy making all the silly posts. Thats me. *Grins proudly*

[smiley clown]

Fanta Im glad u agree that what you are saying is racist because you are accusing not just a nation but half the worlds population of being the root of on of our society's problems.

U say you are generalising but you can't generalise such a tiny minority to say it is the whole race.

As people have said it is the media, and you show just how effective they are at getting their message across.

[Fanta]

Originally posted by Mr. Moo
I think this issue really isn't a good topic to be debating. If you have any opinions about matters such as racism, facism, sexism, anythingelseism, then it's best to just keep your thoughts to yourself.
Discussing things like this is usually something that loses you respect.

This guy was a friend of mine who lost so much respect it was unbelievable.
http://moposite.com/mopolauta/viewtopic.php?t=1594

Edit: Btw, the Chris Penrose guy making all the silly posts. Thats me. *Grins proudly*

i don't see why peoples views on race etc should lose you respect. people are too funny about such issues. if black people posted about whites we would not even be allowed to complain ...

(there she goes again)

[Destrukto]

Is this debate not just about a "wanker" additude?
If someone stikes up an argument with me and tells me that i am wrong because they are black, redheaded, gay, take your pic, i put them in the "wanker" department, ie. they have closed their minds to me...

That is utterly frustrating, but that doesn't disqualify others...

Black people can be wankers
White people can be wankers...

It's not to do with race but with human nature...

[often Ndisguise]

Black people can be wankers
White people can be wankers...

It's not to do with race but with human nature... [/B]

well said! The hostility alot of blacks have towards whites and the consequent hostliity whites have towards blacks creates a negative feed back cycle that never stops. People just cannot focus on the individual it seems.

[Fruiterian]

god. this is a weird topic.

the "gangsta" attitude is being perpetuated by pop culture, and people are buying into it. if people weren't so naive about what the real ghetto is maybe it would stop a little. but all these white kids trying to be "ghetto" is sickening sometimes. not necessarily the attitude, but the whole idea of it. they don't know what a ghetto is, first of all. i'm assuming you all know the origins, which you probably do.

a lot of people are assholes, including blacks, but don't characterize just by that. whites can be assholes. everyone is an asshole to some degree.

as for affirmative action, i'm against. i simply believe that it will do nothing in the long run except rob people who may deserve some position and give it to someone just because they are underrepresented. i say we make race questions illegal on applications. i just don't think it is fair to have race factored into anything.

and the image thing:

http://users.bergen.org/katgor/avatar.jpg without the spaces should give:

http://users.bergen.org/katgor/avatar.jpg

replace the image url with your own and you should be set.

[Fanta]

Originally posted by Fruiterian
i say we make race questions illegal on applications. i just don't think it is fair to have race factored into anything.


i'm all for that. but apparently they are there to keep it fair... never understood that.

and yes people of any race can be bastards and infact they are. All races are bastards. Kill them all. Bar the ginger race for we are superior

...i wonder why peope call me a nazi in here...?

[Fruiterian]

Originally posted by Fanta
All races are bastards. Kill them all. Bar the ginger race for we are superior

...i wonder why peope call me a nazi in here...? [/B]

did you read what you wrote? whatsoever?

i'm just saying that in all races there are wankers, as destruko so brilliantly stated before. but in all races there are those capable. the race thing isn't fair simply because it's adding something to judge/discriminate by in the records.

[Fanta]

of course races aren't fair. not everyone can win them.

why isn't this in the cheese bin or crap basket yet?

[Fruiterian]

Okay. We were reffering to one sort of race in the beginning, and now you refer to another. Why? You were the one that started the topic with the word in mind.

[Fanta]

Originally posted by Fruiterian
Okay. We were reffering to one sort of race in the beginning, and now you refer to another. Why? You were the one that started the topic with the word in mind.

i can talk about any race i like. the topic is race. not just black or whatever. it says at the beggining this is for all issues of race not just my 1st post point.

[SemiCircle]

woo! a disagreement! none of this "yeah, what he said was right" stuff.

unfortuantely, i know almost nothing about the damn topic. i'm from surrey, and i'm at uni in oxford. i am a wasp, to a tee. my contact with blacks is minimal. those few i have met have been nice enough people. i have never met anyone who thought he was a pimp. my only knowledge of such a topic comes from the media, and i know better than to trust that.
so, i simply cannot comprehend the issue. which is an arse, cos i so would have enjoyed arguing it out.

all i can say is that lumping people into categories is a silly idea. but it's already been said. as tom lehrer said "there are people out there who don't love their fellow man, and i hate people like that."

[squealpiggy]

The trouble with Oxford is that it is a socially high up place to study, there tends to be a lot of well off predominately white students there, and the surrounding areas (Cowley etc) are ghettoised areas in which live a lot of disaffected black youths. This means that if you have had little contact with black people Oxford will not give you a good impression. Having said that people warned me about walking along the Cowley Rd at night because it's apparently really rough... compared to where I have lived in Manchester and Ashton it's like Disneyland!

[Fanta]

i cannot love my fellow man. the human race is awful :(

[smiley clown]

I cannot love my fellow man. the human race is awful

said just like that with no reasons for your opinion, just a small sentence condemning us all to be "awful"

You're a cheery person.

[Dr-Electro]

Okay, I see where you are coming from, Fanta. I can understand why other people see you as misstating your case. While the attitude you refer to is not a race-specific attitude, it is adipted by more African-American youths than any other group. Yes, I have observed what you speak of.

The attitude dies not originate with gangsta rap, but is the mind-set that gangsta rap springs from. It is an attitude that says to the world: "I don't gotta respect you or nobody else. You gotta show me the respect I want no matter who youare, no matter where you are, no matter what you are, no matter how old you are. If you disrespect me I gonna throw knuckles on you and fuck you up good." Add to that the concept of: "I will take what I want from anybody who has something I want. Ain't no such thing as crime as long as I don't get caught."

This particular attitude did not originate with the black people of any nation or land. It actually originated in the United States with White Anglo Saxon Protestants who got tired of being categorized as WASPs because they were born into a WASP family. These particular people started trying to act like black people. They had no clue what they were doing, because they had never paid the slightest attention to the overall culture and living conditions of the total black population of the United States.

These misguided youths who were reacting negatively to the "Civil Rights" movement saw some Southern black people on TV acting a cerain way and saying certain things. These white kids heard Dr. King's beautiful and moving, "I have a dream," speech and heard it the wrong way. These young people saw the Watts riots and the Chicago riots on TV and assumed that black people were thugs and rioters by nature. These young whites saw TV news sound bites of black (and Hispanic) gang members talking trash on camera and assumed that Scat was the Lingua Franca of the black community. They looked at the eclectic clothing styles of the gang members on TV and assumed that they were looking at black fashion.

These kids were "self-educated" in what they thought were black ways. They started imitating these ways as a gesture of disrespect toward the black communities. By a mechanism I am unable to fathom, some members of the black community began to imitate what the white kids were doing. I suspect, but I do not assume, that some of them thought it would be fun to poke fun at the white kids who were trying to act black.

Somehow, these antics blended in with other genuine cultural aspects of the black community. The black people who now seem to act this way because they think it is "normal" for them appear to me to be acting as though they are rebelling against "the system" and flouting authority. Right, wrong or indifferent, most of what ou call Black Attitude was once reactionary but is now considered cool. Don't put 100% of the blame on the black kids, it is only by choice (in many cases) that they act the way they do.

For the record, I do not like the attitude. I believe it is hurtful to society in general, regardless who behaves that way. The sorst part of the attitude, and remember that this is only my opinion here, as far as I am concerned is the idea that crime isn't crime unless the perpetrator gets caught. That sort of behavior is damaging to society as a whole. Now, I see that attitude more than ever and not just in young people, not just in any given ethnic group, but as a burgeoning societal trend. It is frightening to watch changes like these take place.

I commend all those who try to act like a part of normal society. I commend all those who think that the "no crime" attitude is wrong. I applaud all who make an effort to obey the laws of the land in which they live. I still try to lead by example and I still try to convince young people to live responsibly. I do not consider myself a racist and I do not see this problem as belonging to any ethnic group or other category of peoples, but as belonging to a rising portion of the population as a whole.

My message is: " Do the right thing. What goes around comes around. "

[ZekeyLizard]

Fanta Read THIS:

Look, I have tried to be quite nice to you. I try to be nice to everyone. Why did you come to my thread and ruin it? Why?

Why Is Fanta Here? Must I chop my Genitals off to get a thread to go Properly Around Here?


I am seriously ready to start saying some really bad words.
Dont make me.

[squealpiggy]

I heard that Fanta has been banished to the chod-bin.

[Dr-Electro]

Fanta's in the cheese. Forget Fanta for now.

I heard some nasty racist remarks today. Some Hispanic kids were bullying a handicapped kid who just happens to be black. they were saying some really nasty things about black people in general and really giving the other kid a hard time both for his handicap and his race. I radioed the Vice Principal and campus cops and they were all busted. I love my walkie-talkie at times.

The kid being bullied is one of the best and brightest we have, but the bullies are a bunch of gangers from Hell. For three of them, this was the last straw. They got shipped out to the Alternative Center, a polite euphemism for Reform School. I hope they turn 21 before they get out so we don't have to see their ugly faces here again. That may not be a nice thing for me to say, but I am being honest about what I think of those particular hoodlums personally. They are bad news and are not willing to change their ways.

[squealpiggy]

I once saw three black kids picking on two Jewish kids. They were shouting "Sieg Heil" in their faces and saying "Heil Hitler" etc. The fucking retards, I asked them if they knew anything about the Third Reich, and told them that next on the agenda was anyone else that didn't fit in with Aryan ideals. I was and still am staggered by the stupidity of some people.

[Dr-Electro]

Hitler told Himmler that the first order of business after conquering America was the extermination of the "Nigers." (actual german word for African people of color)

I had to laugh. I'm not sorry, it just struck me funny. My city has just instituted "mass transit" for the first time in its history. We now have bus service. The bus stops have not been erected yet, so if you want a ride, you stand on the side of the street wiere the bus runs and make a gesture. When the lady on the phone told me what the gesture is supposed to be, I cracked up.

To stop a bus, you stand on the curbside with your arm extended in front of you, palm down.

Sieg? Hahahahahahahahahaha! Not funny? I could not help my self. I was actually helpless with laughter. I can't explain for sure why things like that hit my laugh track, but it happens.

[squealpiggy]

I don't see what is so funny about "Sieg". That's what the chant was to hitler. What was much funnier than that was the way these young boys were saying "Hi Hitler" becuase they were too stupid to know that it was in fact "Heil".

[Dr-Electro]

I was pretty sure I was the only one to find the irony amusing. I knew exactly what I meant and exactly what the operator meant, too. It's just the combination that got me started. Yes, I grew up with a bunch of those little idiots. We are the Baby Boomers who were conceived immediately following the War. (as the old timers called it)

Think of it as more nervous reaction than real amusement.

[squealpiggy]

I thought I had got it wrong, I mean I speak a little German and always understood it as Sieg Heil, thought I could see it being Sich Heil too.

But no, Sieg Heil and yes... the irony. Little idiots those kids...

[eidderf]

You should not judge people on what they look like by thier colour
you only say what someones like once you get to know them fanta .So don't go around saying black people are like this and white people are like that okay

edit i ment should not

[Dr-Electro]

I suspect that Fanta can no longer read your posts. I think Fanta has found a way to get banned.

I don't "judge" people by the color of their skin. I don't judge people at all. I have been accused of judging, but I only relate observations. Yes, I notice other people's apperances. It helps me to tell one friend from another. Identification of individuals is easier if they do not all look exactly alike.

I am not as good with remembering names as I am with remembering how people look. The reason for that is that the human brain stores visual information differently than it stores verbal information. Eventually, like most of the rest of you, I see an individual enough times and connect that individual's name with his/her face that I remember who that person is.

My brain has its own internal method of identifying people by specific characteristics. I will remember a face by all of its visual features, not just the shape and color of its eyes. I see black people as black people, but I can identify one from another by the rest of their features as well. It is the same for all other "races" too.

I can tell Lucy Liu from Stacy Kiebler and can differentiate between them and Arnold Schwartzenegger or Gary Coleman. This notion does not make me a racist. I either like or dislike any individual person based on individual character only. The rest of them are still only individuals I have not met personally. Any sociological trends I am able to identify may or may not bear ethnic classification, but I call them like I see them. If forty out of forty-five black teenagers all behave the same way, I notice it. If fifty percent of all the kids in a given high school class talk louder than everybody else talks, I notice it. That still does not qualify me as a racist.

There are many other people in the world who are the same as me in many respects. Each one of us must examine our own feelings critically. If you have a prejudice, you have a prejudice. Find out why and try to get over it. Otherwise, learn to live with it and learn to avoid using it to harm other people.

Never meet "races" of people, only meet individuals. If you meet someone whose skin color differs from your own, get to know that person on a personal level. Know only individuals, not labels.

[eleanor]

Why does Fanta think she's so right? She's clearly a paragraph from the BNP's manifesto that's somehow managed to evolve into a forumite. What the hell is black attitude? My sister's ex was black (he's Kid Creole's son for anyone who's interested) and I never once noticed anything of that attitude about any of his family.

The behavioural traits Fanta has observed are ones I have noticed to be present in an overwhelmingly white proportion of society - the scallies.

Fanta, see if you can squeeze this into your tiny mind. Does your so-called "black attitude" (urgh) apply, in your opinion, to Trevor MacDonald? Martin Luther King? The myriad black solicitors, businessmen, even most black people in the street?

Originally posted by Fanta
i do have friends.
Who, Enoch and Hitler?

[squealpiggy]

Apparently Martin Luther King was in fact called Michael King, didn't have a pHd and wasn't a reverend, also it is said that he was a communist and a womaniser. But that could all be white supremacist propaganda.

Enoch Powell had white attitude. The ass.

[Shiny_macShine]

Now i am an exremely uncaring person, if my parents died tommorow i could just shrug my shoulders and get on with life but what i do care about is racism. There is nothing i hate more than a racist, it is just the plain ignorance and arrogant unthinking people that form these ill concievied misconceptions that get my back up in a big way. All humans are genetically 99% percent the same but in personality we are at least in some small way all individuals. Mostly your personalitys are shaped from the people and environment around you especially when your young and mentally vulnerable. If a black person grows up in a ghetto environment that they have to sometimes struggle to survive in then theres nothing you can do about having that kind of attitude, so why complain about them having that attitude? Quite clearly not all of black people are anywhere near this misconception anyway. If people really thought about these subjects instead of being so arrogant as to make these idiotic comments and automatically think there right, the world would be a much better place. But there are many people who are somehow not able to access there brains

[Cossack]

There we go, pure example of brainwashing.

If he doesn't like black communities, it's not 'cos he's racist. It's 'cos he just doesn't like to be an outsider.

Why people say "white trash" but they do not say "black trash"?

Why people ask "what ethnic group are you in"?

Why statistics separate white from black?

Why NO president of USA was black, as well as almost no congressmen?

And why there are still "Blacks only" clubs? We're one race, we don't need no agencies for black people...

Why do cities still have areas where only blacks live?

(Why University of Princeton has almost no blacks?)

Racism is still in the air. But now, brainwashed generation comes in. I know how Fanta feels(it tastes like orange and coke), if you call him racist-like then ask yourself these questions(stated above).

I have a few black-colored friends, and they are good people. But... they are 3 out of million surrounding me. I am not racist, I don't run around yelling that all blacks are ***** and ******ing ****s. I am just showing the facts.

[squealpiggy]

Originally posted by Cossack
There we go, pure example of brainwashing.

If he doesn't like black communities, it's not 'cos he's racist. It's 'cos he just doesn't like to be an outsider.

Why people say "white trash" but they do not say "black trash"?

Why people ask "what ethnic group are you in"?

Why statistics separate white from black?

Why NO president of USA was black, as well as almost no congressmen?

And why there are still "Blacks only" clubs? We're one race, we don't need no agencies for black people...

Why do cities still have areas where only blacks live?

(Why University of Princeton has almost no blacks?)

Racism is still in the air. But now, brainwashed generation comes in. I know how Fanta feels(it tastes like orange and coke), if you call him racist-like then ask yourself these questions(stated above).

I have a few black-colored friends, and they are good people. But... they are 3 out of million surrounding me. I am not racist, I don't run around yelling that all blacks are ***** and ******ing ****s. I am just showing the facts.

I'm not entirely sure where you are going with this post. Do you mean that we are inherently racist because of these facts, or that because of these facts we should be racist? Racism exists, and is politically rife not far from where I live in Burnley and Oldham where you have groups like the BNP winning council seats with undertones of racial violence and groups like Hizb-Ut-Tahrir inciting racial violence against whites, then you have the Anti Nazi League advocating violence against people who's opinion you don't share... But it doesn't make it right, or sensible.

[DK999k]

Its just the way we are brought up, i dont agree with the current stance on racism*, but it really isnt going to COMPLETLY change, in this generation anyway.

[Dr-Electro]

I was born in a time that is considered by many to be "a time of innocence." Hah! It was only innocent for the white population of a couple of nations. America most notably.

I was born without prejudice. We all are. Throw babies of different colors and cultures together and watch what happens. Some play happily, others pull hair and bite each other. Some scream and cry while others laugh and giggle. But look at how they group together! White baby next to black baby and both of them trading pacifiers with a yellow baby. A red baby next to a brown baby and both crying about wet pants. A Hindu baby next to an Islamic baby next to a Jewish baby and a WASP baby and not one of them cares half a babyshit about religion or culture. They are just poor, ignorant babies.

Then, parents and other big people get involved. They fuck up the baby's mind with trash talk about, "Niggers, Kikes, Ragheads and Slant-eyes." I don't condone the use of those hate words, other people use them as everyday nouns.

Back to the biography: I started school in an all-white neighborhood, just another pasty-faced, towheaded (My hair had zero pigmentation, it was transparent which made everybody else think it was platinum blonde.) white boy. I fit right in with all the neighbors.

We moved. From Texas to South Dakota. (Not a brilliant decision ot the part of my parents.) I met more kids up there. Some were Sioux Indians. Nice kids, we played together all the time. There was a Japanese family in town, I played with them, too. The father of that family operated the town (actually more of a village) snowplow. We all got along fine. I didn't notice very many people talking about "niggers" or any other racial slurs. There was sort of a friendly rivalry between the Norwegians and Germans (add hyphens and American to them) that was harmless and meaningless. We all went to Church and ate each other's potluck dinners.

We moved to the sloppy, messy city of Minneapolis. (Not intended as a slur on that fine city or its people.) I felt lost. I was a farm boy for poop's sake. I knew about cows, chickens, hogs and dogs. The city terrified me for a while. I went to school in an open, racially mixed environment. I liked nearly all of the other snotty-nosed five-year-olds who seemed to be just like me: human. It didn't make me any difference what they looked like. It just didn't matter. I remember in hindsight that there were more white kids than anybody else, but all "races" were present.

We moved back to Texas. Wee-ha. I went to segregated schools and people talked about "the other side of the tracks" and "that negro school over there." The grownups told nigger jokes. Not knowing any better, I just laughed along with everybody else. I felt vaguely stupid, but didn't know why. I had black friends there, too, but they were shoe-shine boys and tire-busters in gas stations. (The neighborhood barbershop and gas station were local hangouts all over the South and Southwest.)

In school, as I grew I learned more racial slurs and learned that none of the other white kids trusted any of the Mexican kids. I couldn't figure out why. I was bullied all the time for being a "Nigger-lover" and a "Messkin lover" because I hung out with anybody who would give me the time of day. Nobody else looked funny to me except the kid with the flame-red hair and billions of freclkes. He was a mean little bastard and we fought daily.

I graduated from High School having witnessed the Civil Rights Movement in America first hand. It took place right there in little old Muleshoe, Texas and Pecos, Texas where I finished High School.

Went off to the Navy, happy to share barracks facilities with Black, Oriental, and Hispanic recruits from eveywhere. Met some kids from The Phillipine Islands who played chess like Gary Kasparov. They were killers at poker, too. I heard some rough talk from everybody else about, "Whitey, Honky, the Niggers, the Huks, (Filipino people) and Kikes. I had to ask what most of those words meant. I was ridiculed roundly.

I was swept up in things so fast I hardly knew what was happening moment-by-moment. I graduated UDT and then Navy Seal. I was too tough for anybody to ridicule me and walk away unhurt. I had fellow Seals who were genuine brothers-in-arms. We were all "races" mixed together and all the same inside and out: tough, mean warriors from America.

During my last year in the Navy, after peace had broken out in Viet Nam, I was sent to a series of seminars. Some fat-assed bureaucrat in Washington had dreamed up an idea to "Remove prejudice and racial tension" among the ranks. That actually means that some stupid busybody of a desk jockey had heard about a white sailor and a black sailor giving each other some grief about being white and black. Big effing deal. It never amounted to a hill of beans, anyway.

However, we all had to attend "Upward Seminars" where high-ranking black sailors and officers "facilitated" confrontation sessions where we all discussed prejudice. Supposedly, we were all equal in those seminars and not one person's opinion was any more important than anyone else's opinion. Bullshit. Those high-ranking blacks shoved a lot of nonsense at the rest of us. They tried to tell me that black people were incapable of being prejudiced. They said that only white people could be prejudiced and that every body else were victims of white oppression. I got pissed off at them and almost got court-martialed for disagreeing with them. So much for being equal of opinion!

I am still not prejudiced, but I learned what prejudice is and have been the target of the prejudices of others. I don't like it and I don't believe anyone else should be any more prejudiced than I am.

Knowing all that, can you believe that a totally objective observer like me can see a little tiny bit of that "black attitude?" Can you believe that I see at least as much, "White Attitude?" How about "Mexican Attitude?" Those concepts rankle deeply. I don't like them, but they exist. Fanta does not know how to express these concepts gently or objectively, but she is right to a certain extent.

I say do not react to those attitudes with defensive retalliation. Do not embrace those attitudes as though you were born the wrong color or ethnicity. Learn what is different between yourself and any individual person you meet. Get to know why that black girl in Third Period Geometry thinks all whiteys are cracker-asses. You won't change her mind by knowing why, but you can learn not to act like a cracker-ass. You can also learn not to act like her, as well. Her attitude is as wrong as is the attitudes of the cracker-asses.

Try not to judge each other too harshly. Try to find out why Fanta is so bitte towards the black attitude. Fanta, try to figure out why so many other people react to your ideas and posts the way they do. Learn from each other, learn from their mistakes, but look in the damned mirror to find out what sucks about yourself, too. You are not perfect and neither am I. I am not afraid to look myself in the eye every morning and say, "What can you do to be a better human being today?" Self-examination can be painful, but it is a damn sight better than condemning everyone else for not being you.

Oops. I rambled again. End of Biographical Sketch.

[squealpiggy]

America has by all accounts some very powerful lobby groups working for various minorities, most started with the best of intentions but now getting out of hand a touch, groups like the Anti Defamation League. I would say that opinions of Jews is fairly high in the world now, noone hates Jews, it's a non-issue. So they make the shift from preotection of Jews to promotion of Jews. Not that I care about that in of itself but when that starts to encroach on the freedoms of other "ethnic groups" for example whites or Asians it's time to take a step back. It's the same for Affirmative Action groups, as you put above they appear to have a racist agenda of beatifying black people and demonising white.

Then you have more radical groups like Nation of Islam, who advocate apartheid, stating that only by being seperate can both "races" flourish. Utter garbage. If you go somewhere were there is official or unofficial segregation by race and you find more trouble, for example in Oldham there are "no-go areas" for white people and similar for asians. A friend of mine got badly beaten up in a racially provoked attack for being white in the wrong part of town (I suppose expecting racists not to beat you up because you are not racist against them is like expecting a bull not to charge because you are a vegetarian...) and racial tensions are high. Go to Toronto, it has very low rates of racially motivated crime (considering the size of the city) because it is very integrated. The thing that these separatists don't seem to grasp is that while it's easy to hate them pakis/niggers/gooks it's not easy to hate Rifat, Michael or Gordon (an Asian woman, a black guy and a Chinese kid I know). Integration = acceptance. Maybe that's what the seperatists are scared of.