England thread

[dogincognito]

Englands first match in the build up to the WC qualifiers, against Ukraine is in 9 days, so i tohught i'd make a thread to discuss England's WC qualifying campaign.


The biggest news is Paul Scholes' international retirement and Rooney's injury which will rule out of the first two qualifiers. Scholes is no big loss, he had already been moved out to the left 'cause Frank Lampard has taken his place, he wouldn't have been a first team player by WC2006. In Rooney's place i'd like to see Smith or Beattie, although it'll more likely be Heskey :( I'd also like to see Shawn Wright-Philips, Chris Kirkland, Scott Parker and maybe Robert Green in the squad, and maybe Gareth Barry on the left of midfield if he starts the season well. Apart from that i think we won't be much different to Euro 2004, maybe with Neville being edged out of the first team as the qualifiers go on. I think we've got a good team, and squad:

Goalkeepers: James, Kirkland, Robinson, Green

Leftbacks: Cole, Bridge
Right backs: Gary Neville (Phil too although he shouldnt make the squad), Carragher*, Mills, Glen Johnson
Centre backs: Woodgate, Campbell, Ferdinand, Terry, King, Carragher*

Left Midfield: Barry? Gray?
Right midfield: Beckham*, Wright Phillips, Hargreaves*, Dyer*, Pennant? Milner?
Central Midfield: Gerrard, Lampard, Beckham*, Parker, Hargreaves*, Cole, Dyer*, Butt, Davis?

Strikers: Owen, Rooney, Defoe, Smith, Vassell, Dyer*, Beattie, Heskey, Stead?

?= players who could be in the squad in the future
*= Multiple positions

The only position we're really lacking is left wing, and maybe right back but hopefully some young players will emerge before the world cup.

In the longer term I really hope a good left winger emerges. Julian Gray the new Birmingham left winger has a decent reputation we'll see how he does in the Premiership this season. Also unless Beckham picks up he might not be first choice at Germany 2006 (assuming we're there of course), he could be replaced by Wright-Phillips or Jermaine Pennant.

[dogincognito]

Sorry to double post, but the squads been named:

Goalkeepers: James (Man City), Robinson (Tottenham), Kirkland (Liverpool)

Defenders: G Neville (Man Utd), G Johnson (Chelsea), A Cole (Arsenal), Bridge (Chelsea); Terry (Chelsea), King (Tottenham), Carragher (Liverpool), Upson (Birmingham)

Midfielders: Beckham (Real Madrid), Lampard (Chelsea), Gerrard (Liverpool), Dyer (Newcastle), Hargreaves (Bayern Munich), Butt (Newcastle), Wright-Phillips (Man City), Jenas (Newcastle)

Forwards: Owen (Real Madrid), Heskey (Birmingham), Vassell (Aston Villa), Defoe (Tottenham), Smith (Man Utd)

Injuries:
Campbell
Woodgate
Rooney


Hopefully we won't see Phil Neville in another England squad, probably won't see Ian Walker either.

Im glad to see Wright-Phillips and Defoe in, although i'm not sure about Glen Johnson, Jermaine Jenas and to a lesser extent Alan Smith. Heskey still in to, and Butt :confused:

I'd start:

----------------Robinson-------------

Carragher-----King----Upson-----Bridge

SWP------Gerrard(c)--Lampard----Hargreaves

--------------Owen-----Smith---------


Give some youngsters a try.

[Thomp]

I'd play Defoe ahead of Smith personally

[dogincognito]

I wouldn't play Defoe and Owen together though. I'd give Defoe the second half probably.

[Thomp]

Suppose. Might work, you never know.

[Nuclear Spoon]

Oh, the possibilities...:rolleyes:

[dogincognito]

Oh, the possibilities...:rolleyes:

huh?


Anyhoo....

The starting lineup for the Ukraine game has been announced:

James, Neville, Cole, Terry, King, Beckham, Butt, Lampard, Gerrard, Owen, Smith


I want to know why is Nicky Butt playing :mad:
We were negative enough without him at Euro 2004 :mad:
Also this means going back to the diamond or even if it's not the diamond Gerrard or Lampard will be on the left :nana:

[Evil Egg]

i think Joe Cole would do well on the left. he's both footed, i believe, and has bags of talent. Only problem is he doesn't get a game a Chelsea.

personally i would drop owen and play Smith and Defoe. Both have made good starts to the season, and i would be interested in how well they play together.

[el_diablo5711]

dave james needs to be out... he hasnt performed.

bring in Chris Kirkland

[PJ]

I would give a player like phillips and defoe a star for this match.

Id also like to see owen out of the squad.

[el_diablo5711]

owen is great... he needs to be in the squad...

however hes no longer with liverpool which pisses me off

[PJ]

Im sorry owen is shit.

If hes in the squad rooney has to score wich we was lucky to have, but now hes gone we need two scorers like defoe and smith.

Oh yeah and david james has had 1 bad game so lets cross him off the list, get real.

[Evil Egg]

Personally i've never liked David James, even in his days at Liverpool. However, he continues to play at a high level, in the premiership, so he couldn't be that bad.

i would like to see Robinson given a chance at international level. i think he could be another great English keeper. i would choose him just ahead of kirkland due to the fact he is playing week in, week out.

[el_diablo5711]

he shouldnt be though -- keller should

[dogincognito]

Im sorry owen is shit.

If hes in the squad rooney has to score wich we was lucky to have, but now hes gone we need two scorers like defoe and smith.

Oh yeah and david james has had 1 bad game so lets cross him off the list, get real.

You know as much about football as you do about anything else.





Joe Cole hasn't done anything to get in the squad let alone the team, although if Chelsea play him he wil improve.

Im really not happy about Butt playing. Surely Scholes' retirement should cement Gerrard and Lampard as trhe first choice central pairing. And I'd rather see Hargreaves/Dyer/Beckham in the centre than Butt.

Can't understand why Jenas is in the squad either. He's never been more than average for Newcastle. Sven says he wants to try Jenas and Dyer in the second half, but neither of them should be above Wright-Phillips in the pecking order :mad:

[Nuclear Spoon]

Well there is one piece of good news. Heskey's out. Hurrah. And we should never play him again until he starts playing well.

[PJ]

No heskey.

That is very good news, VERY good news.

[Handwashed Pug]

England 3 Ukraine 0

Beckham 28
Owen 50
Wright - Phillips 72

Twas a pretty good performance, Beckham was far more influencal and David James was very confident in goal, Gerrard looked pretty good on the left.
Lampard is still World Class in the centre. Ashley Cole was still getting forward on the left ( ala Euro 2004) and Glen Johnsen looked dangerous as Right back, Wright Phillips was good but I don't think he's good enough to have a permanent role out on the right, as I feel Sven will always keep Beckham on the right.

The Ukraniens weren't as good as I expected though, I thought Shevchenco would be far more influencal but he looked rather average in attack tonight, their midfield wasn't up to much, and their keeper seemed to flap around a bit ( he should have got to Terry's cross really, good to see Beckham getting a goal tho ;))

All in all it was a good performance, the manager had a point to prove, and he showed that at times England can play well at times, I think the only minus point was the turnout - 38000 in a 52000 stadium is pretty poor really, and when you charge £40 + for a ticket I can see why ( tickets for the Division 2 play off final were as cheap as 24 quid )

Overall I'd give the team 8/10, they played well at times, weren't ever sloppy, and got a good score to proove it

[PJ]

Sven goran erikson lalalalala sven goran erikson lalalalala.

Shaun wright-phillips is one of the best players ever. His debut and he scores.

[Dick Champion]

Sven goran erikson lalalalala sven goran erikson lalalalala.

Shaun wright-phillips is one of the best players ever. His debut and he scores.

And what a goal!

[dogincognito]

Good performance tonight.

Beckham was much improved, worked hard as well as setting up one and scoring one.
Gerrard was good despite being played out of position.
Lampard made a lot of good runs.
Shaun Wright-Phillips was excellent, he should be tried on the left for the world cup qualifying games, that goal was typical of what he does at City week in week out :cool:



Butt was worthless.
Smith was directionless.
Defoe was directionless and i bit too selfish :x Apart from one good shot did nothing worthwhile, and missed a sitter :(

[Jasmic]

Well there is one piece of good news. Heskey's out. Hurrah. And we should never play him again until he starts playing well.

Well thats Heskey buggered then!

[PJ]

Ratings.

top 5 (no order.)

James
Shaun wright-phillips
Beckham
Lampard
Owen (i do think he did well)

[jonffm]

Just a notwe to any Newcastle fans that agreed with the boo'ing aimed at Dyer, your a fucking disgrace and an embarassment to English football.

You don't boo your own nation's players over some stupid disagreement in club football, and frankly, I was shamed to be English.

Twas a bloody disgrace.

Peej, when will you stop being such an idiot. Owen is not a crap player, at the very least, he's a good player. Even calling him good is an injustice.

No shit player can score 20 goals average a season in the world's toughest league. Now stop being so shit.

[Nuclear Spoon]

Well I agree with everything Jonny said apart from Owen. He's just above average, on a good day.

[dogincognito]

I agree with everything Jonny said :ninja:

Owen is an excellent striker, one of the best in the world on form, and even off form he still scores :rolleyes:






:p

[PJ]

I have to admit he used to be good.

But pre-season and euro 2004 its all gone down hill for him really. It might be problems at home or his minds on leaving liverpool, but euro 2004 and pre seaon has not been good for him.

He had a good game last night hough maybe his mind was on a transfer hopefully now he'll be back to his scoring times, and more games on form.

[Ouroboros]

A good game, and a great goal from Wright-Philips. I think that Owen should make way one of these days, he starts every match, but he just isn't that good anymore.

One thing I didn't understand, why was Dyer being booed by the fans? Is it something to do with Newcastle?

[Nuclear Spoon]

Yeah, something about being asked to play on the right but he didn't want to...

[Thomp]

I reckon Gerard and Beckham were better than James, but only cos James didn't have much to do.

Well in Wright-Philips! Everyone see Ian's reaction?

[el_diablo5711]

but the number one reason that this game was great, was because beckham missed no penalties

lets all celebrate

[Nuclear Spoon]

Yeah as soon as he scored the goal Wright had his mobile in his hands... probably to tell the damn Gooners to sign him when they can... :mad: and yes Beckham missed no penalties. But he did miss a few free kicks.

[Evil Egg]

No shit player can score 20 goals average a season in the world's toughest league.

Michael Owen has never scored 20 premiership goals in one season. the best he's managed was 19.

[jonffm]

19 then...one goal difference..the point's still the same.

Let's not forget he is also the youngest player to win the Golden Boot, play for England score for England and score in the World Cup Finals for England.

Now tell me that's an average player..

[Evil Egg]

makes you wonder why he's rated so highly though, 20 goals is seen as the bench mark for a good season, and he's never reached it. that said, i think a moving to Real could really improve his game. look at how well beckham played for the 1st half of last season.

[dogincognito]

20 goals in one season in all competitions is considered a good season. Owen has achieved that. Lots. If you look at his strike rate for his whole career you'll see its very good :rolleyes:

[Evil Egg]

you have to admit that the best strikers usually score more than 20 premiership goals though. Van Nistelrooy, Henry, Shearer, they all usually score in the mid twenties, less than that would be considered a failure.

[dogincognito]

I don't think any of them did it between the ages of 17 and 24 though. Because Owen's been around so long people forget how young he is. His best years should still be ahead of him.

[Evil Egg]

they should be, and as i said, i think playing and training with world-class strikers at Real will improve his game. i just think his form has been pretty average over the past year or two.

[dogincognito]

England's 23-man squad to face Austria and Poland:
Goalkeepers: James (Man City), Robinson (Tottenham), Green (Norwich).
Defenders: G Neville (Man Utd), A Cole (Arsenal), Bridge (Chelsea), Terry (Chelsea), King (Tottenham), Carragher (Liverpool), Upson (Birmingham).
Midfielders: Beckham (Real Madrid), Lampard (Chelsea), Gerrard (Liverpool), Dyer (Newcastle), Hargreaves (Bayern Munich), Butt (Newcastle), Wright-Phillips (Man City), J Cole (Chelsea), Jenas (Newcastle).
Strikers: Owen (Real Madrid), Vassell (Aston Villa), Defoe (Tottenham), Smith (Man Utd).


I'm sure you'll all be pleased to see Heskey hasn't been picked.

[Nuclear Spoon]

Oh yes. Indeed. Now, who's missing...or rather, who shouldn't be there. Owen and Beckham. But then I just have general prejudice against them.

[Bloopo]

Nah, couldn't miss out Owen and Beckham, after all, they are the team mascots.

[dogincognito]

:rolleyes: whatever dude..... :rolleyes:

I'd play:

----------------------------Green------------------------------

G. Neville----------Terry-------------King-----------Cole

Beckham----------Lampard--------Gerrard--------SWP (if fit)

---------------------Smith------------Owen-----------------

[Leonidas]

England's 23-man squad to face Austria and Poland:
Goalkeepers: James (Man City), Robinson (Tottenham), Green (Norwich).
Defenders: G Neville (Man Utd), A Cole (Arsenal), Bridge (Chelsea), Terry (Chelsea), King (Tottenham), Carragher (Liverpool), Upson (Birmingham).
Midfielders: Beckham (Real Madrid), Lampard (Chelsea), Gerrard (Liverpool), Dyer (Newcastle), Hargreaves (Bayern Munich), Butt (Newcastle), Wright-Phillips (Man City), J Cole (Chelsea), Jenas (Newcastle).
Strikers: Owen (Real Madrid), Vassell (Aston Villa), Defoe (Tottenham), Smith (Man Utd).


I'm sure you'll all be pleased to see Heskey hasn't been picked.

The only reason Heskey hasn't been picked is becasue he's injured. Not becasue Eriksson has suddenly become a good manager. He's picker Dyer. Why? Hargreaves. Why? And Jenas. Again, why? Why hasn't he picked Gareth Barry of Aston Villa? A good young LEFT SIDED midfielder. And I would have also picked Beattie beofre Vassel, and yes, Owen.

[dogincognito]

I'd have Beattie in instead of Defoe or Vassell, probably Vassell. Barry was woeful last season, although the season before he was excellent and didn't get picked :(

Hargreaves is a good player. I don't like people having a go at him just 'cause they don't see him play.

Jenas and Dyer i agree haven't done anything to get in.

Sven
The door is not closed for Emile Heskey, but I've seen a lot of Alan Smith and Jermain Defoe recently and they deserve their chance this time," said Eriksson.

"I want to make clear that Emile has never let England down and is still very much part of my thinking.

He's not injured. They thought he might be but he wasn't and played yesterday.

[Nuclear Spoon]

Green? You're shitting me, right?

Robinson
G Neville Terry King Cole
Beckham* Gerrard Lampard SWP
Defoe Owen**

*Because we haven't got anyone better, unfortunately
** Because Defoe plays well with Owen

[dogincognito]

Robinson makes schoolboy errors. Hes a good shotstopper, but so is Green. Possibly better. Defoe and Owen are to similar, Smith is also looking like a really good player. Shame he's a racist moron.

[Leonidas]

What schoolboy errors has Robinson made so far this season? Not one. In fact he's been the most in form keeper in the Premiership so far I would argue.

[dogincognito]

meh, you can't judge on 3 or 4 games. He made quite a few last season, including a clanger on his England debut. I just think Green is better.
Doesnt matter though, Sven isn't going to drop James anyway :rolleyes:

---------------------------------------------------------

Owen debuts for Real

Michael Owen has made a winning start to his Real Madrid debut, playing a key role in their 1-0 win over Mallorca.

Owen failed to make Real's starting 11 as coach Jose Antonio Camacho opted to deploy strikers Raul and Ronaldo.

But Owen did not have to wait long to get on to the pitch replacing the injured Raul on 24 minutes.

Early in the second half Owen created Real's opening goal when he crossed for Ronaldo, who chested the ball home at the far post.


Sounds like he played well, anyone got Sky Sports and see the game?

[Nuclear Spoon]

Is Austria v England gonna be on terrestrial tonight? Because I'm not sure if N. Ireland vs Poland will be quite as entertaining.

[jonffm]

Sky sports pieman. So I don't think it is. How do you survive though? Having to listen to trevor bloody brooking every england game. I couldn't take it..

Score predictions anyone?

I'm gunna go with 2-0, possibly 3 if we play well. Wright Philips to score at least once.

[dogincognito]

2-0 i think. Probably won't play well :rolleyes:

[Nuclear Spoon]

dogincognito, we never play well. But oddly enough we seem to win most of the time...

[Leonidas]

I've been listening to talkSport radio (1053/1089am) and the phone in about the England game tonight, and alot of English people are calling in hoping that England lose tonight! Essentially they are complaining about Sven, how they are sick of his unadventurous ways and his seemingly lacklustre approach, and even just sick of the man himself. By wanting England to lose they are hoping it will be a catalyst for change. Where do others here stand on this subject?

[jonffm]

2-2, how pathetic.

You can pretty much sum the game up in 4 words. "James, you fucking donkey."

I think I speak for a pretty large majority of england fans when I say..

SVEN OUT!

[Shave]

calamity james. bring on woodward :rolleyes:

[jonffm]

Polands gotta be his last chance, and seeing how they played in their first game, we don't stand a chance.

I can't say the team played that badly, it was an OK match for 9 of the players. The two crap players being James, again, and Beck's, who was just lazy through the entire game.

The one plus was a great goal by Gerrard. Vintage Gerrard.

[AngryPaul]

Hmmmm..... keepers being dropped after errors in qualifiers - Sound familiar?

[Leonidas]

Why does Eriksson stick with James? His knickname is Calamity James ffs! This is the weakness of Eriksson, he is unable to make big decisions, important decisions. Robinson is a far better keeper than James, yet Sven is too stuck in his ways, and TOO friendly with the players. Same thing happened in Euro 2004 where, despite not being fit, he played Beckham in every game, all game!

I beleive that Eriksson will play James in goal again on Wed. If he actually changes things then I will be amazed!

People say that Robinson doesn't have the experience at International level, and so how can he be played? I aks, how can he get the experience???? And surely he plays harder games, and has to deal with more, in a premiership game against Arsenal, Man Utd, Villa, than he will against Poland!

[dogincognito]

Fitness fears over Beckham

Captain David Beckham is an injury worry for England's World Cup qualifier with Poland on Wednesday after leaving training early on Monday.

The Real Madrid midfielder suffered a rib injury in the draw with Austria and is undergoing a medical assessment.

Steven Gerrard also sat out part of the training session but an FA spokesman said it was a precautionary measure.

But Chelsea's Wayne Bridge was fully involved in training, despite taking a knock to his Achilles against Austria.

England are flying to Poland on Monday afternoon, with the first training session planned for Tuesday afternoon.

Beckham will be assessed again on Tuesday morning before a decision is taken on whether he can resume training.

Nicky Butt, however, will not be joining up with the squad as he continues to receive treatment to a hamstring injury in Newcastle.

Coach Sven-Goran Eriksson expressed hope last week that the midfielder might be ready for the Poland match but decided, after talks with Newcastle, that Butt should remain in England.

to be honest (as i always normally skate around the subject, mostly i plain lie) i'd be happy if Beckham missed the game. I'd like to see how we do without him :rolleyes:

A year ago he was one of the best players in the world, he seems to have lost it a lot. I dunno what it is down to, his age maybe? Or the training in Spain having a major effect on his fitness? He can still whip out a pin-point ball but there was a time when he would get in positions to cross the ball accurately 10-20 times a game, so there was usually at least 1 goal a game from his crossing. This just doesn't seem to happen as much anymore, i think he needs to concentrate on being a wide midfield player and get back to how he used to perform. I get the feeling that he may think he is that good to play in the middle, and tries to play as a central midfielder even when played on the right :rolleyes:

I wish he hadn't left ManU now :(

[Nuclear Spoon]

OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOONNNNNNNNNNNNNN EEEEEEEEEEEEE-NIIIIIIIIIIIIIIILLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLL TOOO THE ENGERLAAAAAANDDDD!!!

DEFOE! WHO THE FUCK ELSE!!! :WOO:

Sorry. Kinda over-reacted.

[jonffm]

Oh look. We lose a goal. I'm really surprised.

The rate we're playing, we're going to lose.

[Thomp]

So it's 1-1 then. I ain't surprised.

I'm going to support Ireland. See you later...

[Nuclear Spoon]

Jonny, unfortuantely, we won't. We will draw. We play crap, but manage to avoid losing.

[jonffm]

Oh look..now we're winning..

*Sigh* Oh well..still 30 mins to go yet...we need another goal.

[Nuclear Spoon]

Wish it wasn't Owen who scored though...But a goal's a goal.

[Rojo]

England 2-1 Poland

All i Have to say is, how did Defoe cantrol that ball.
Oh yes and another point, the second goal was counted as an own_goal.

[Nuclear Spoon]

England 2-1 Poland

All i Have to say is, how did Defoe cantrol that ball.

Because he's a sodding legend, child.

[jonffm]

That game was such a bloody let-off. In a way I wish we drew, because it would have been Sven out me thinks.

I want Terry Venables or the legend himself, Sir Bobby Robson. We need an english manager back in charge, none of this damn swede nonsence.

Appart from those two, I'd be happy seeing us under the helm of Harry Redknapp, Alan Curbishly(sp?), Sir Clive Woodward or Jonathan Ross. All would do a much better job than Sven IMO.

[dogincognito]

Squad for games against Wales and Azerbaijan:
Goalkeepers: James (Man City), Robinson (Tottenham), Green (Norwich).
Defenders: Terry (Chelsea, Ferdinand (Man Utd), King (Tottenham), Campbell (Arsenal), A Cole (Arsenal), G Neville (Man Utd), P Neville (Man Utd), Carragher (Liverpool).
Midfielders: Butt (Newcastle), Hargreaves (Bayern Munich), J Cole (Chelsea), Lampard (Chelsea), Jenas (Newcastle), Beckham (Real Madrid), Wright-Phillips (Man City).
Forwards: Rooney (Man Utd), Smith (Man Utd), Owen (Real Madrid), Defoe (Tottenham), Vassell (Aston Villa).


I'd play:

----------------------Green-------------

G.Neville-----Ferdinand----Campbell-----A. Cole

Beckham(c)---Gerrard---Lampard----Jenas

--------------Owen-----Defoe---------

Rooney would be supersub :D

[Sk£tch]

Why are Phil Neville, David James and Darius Vassell even in the team?!

[Handwashed Pug]

I'm sure Sven would never even think of going 4-3-3 but I've always thought it wouldn't be that bad. Heres what I'd like to see -

---------------------Robinson--------------------

--G. Neville---Ferdinand--Campbell---A. Cole

-------Beckham (C)--Lampard--Gerrard--

-----------------------Rooney
-----------------Defoe--------Owen-----------------


This would allow Beckham to play both central, and right sided roles, give Lampard a central position and let Ashley Cole attack down the left, with Gerrard able to play central and drift onto the left as well (as he did against Croatia)
It also lets Rooney play behind the front two which makes a rather spiffy attacking force, that would (in theory) terrorise defenses, and be a force to be feared.

The sad thing is its never gonna happen. Ahh well, works on PES :D

[Nuclear Spoon]

Why are Phil Neville, David James and Darius Vassell even in the team?!

Well because Vassell's half decent on his day, doubt he'll get a game. And Neville and James just because we haven't got anyone better. And Gerrard's out, by the way.

Personally:

Robinson
G Neville King Campbell A Cole/Bridge
Wright-Philips Lampard(c) Hargreaves J Cole
Defoe Rooney

I left out Beckham because quite frankly, I don't think we need him and the same with Owen, who is now poop.
Argue with me all you like, but that is my opinion.

And yes Jonny, Jonathan Ross would do a much better job than Sven:D

[Chavvy]

I totally agree with leaving out Beckham and the super-bench-warmer-Owen, but you know ole Svenny boy will pick them both :rolleyes:

The problem with have is England have kinda lost their way in the last year or two. We have some class emerging talent (world class even) that don't get games or are bit players to has-beens who were good in their day.

SVEN - take a leaf out of your own book. Remember Seamen??? Do the same with Beckham and Owen...

[Thomp]

You have go to be kidding if you think that Sven will leave out Ferdinand, and Beckham, and Owen...though Owen and Beckham should go.

[Nuclear Spoon]

A few links I found:

Alan Hansen=Twat (http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/football/internationals/3713330.stm)
Whatever, innit (http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/funny_old_game/3719772.stm)
Damn Right, Geoffy (http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/football/internationals/3719526.stm)

You can say that I am biased towards Defoe because he plays for Spurs, but there you go.

[chicken_pie]

Looks like For England vs Wales Sven will be playing the diamond formation used against iceland all those months ago with a few changes:

Robinson
G. Neville------Ferdinand------Campbell------A.Cole
Butt
Beckam--------------------Lampard
Rooney
Owen--------Defoe

Overall it looks a pretty strong squad, when gerrard returns it'll be stronger as i dont have to much confidence in nicky butt. I think Sven's gamble of playing rooney, owen and defoe will pay of with a win, should be a good paced match, am also looking forward to the Ireland France match, im hoping Ireland pull it of, would make the irish half of me so happy

[Wahoo]

half time score: england 1-0 wales

[Shave]

i very pleased in the way that the game's tunred out so far. it's not a complete whitewash, yet it's not the usual pace of an england match. it's been played quickly and i think it's been exciting and the formation's worked well. owen's playing well giving his situation but get beckham off and bring on Shaun Wright-phillips :D

[jonffm]

WOOT!

2-0, to the En-ger-land.

For once, I can't really fault anyone. Beckhams passing was great throught the whole match, but his shooting was abit abit poor untill that AMAZING goal. Owen played well, and was very unlucky not to get a goal. Rooney was normal rooney, and ran rings round Wales. How he didn't get one is anyones guess. Butt was OK I guess..Defoe wasn't bad, and Lampard was great...as was the whole defence!

With Gerrard in the center, I think the 4-3-3 formation could work for us.

Great result though :D

[Nuclear Spoon]

Still think we played shit until the last 15 minutes...

[Dingbat]

You weren't so great, calm down. :p Chris is right.

Wales were fuckawful though. Very bad.

[dogincognito]

With Gerrard in the center, I think the 4-3-3 formation could work for us.

Great result though :D

With Gerrard in the centre the 4-3-3 would suck, Gerrard isn't defensive enough.

Decent performance, Owen was good as was Rooney. It's great for England having Rio and Sol back together, they're two of the best in the world.

Stupid booking for Beckham, i hope SWP plays on Wednesday rather than Hargreaves =/

[Dingbat]

With Gerrard in the centre the 4-3-3 would suck, Gerrard isn't defensive enough.

Decent performance, Owen was good as was Rooney. It's great for England having Rio and Sol back together, they're two of the best in the world.

Stupid booking for Beckham, i hope SWP plays on Wednesday rather than Hargreaves =/
Hargreaves was coming on already, it wasn't a planned swap methinks.

[Shave]

hopefully it was tactical for sven to bring hargreaves on as he was saving swp for the full 90mins he will play against azerb....:p

i din't really think beckham was great apart from the goal, and it looks to me like he's broken his foot. don't really understand why neville and but were playing but what the hey.

so. waht's your ideal formation for the next match. if gerrard is back it'll be:

......................Robinson.................... ....

King........Ferdinand....Campbell......Cole

..Wright-Phillips...Gerrard...Lampard......
........................Rooney.................... ......
.............Defoe...............Owen............. ...

subs:

Green
Barry
Terry
Routledge (:p)
Pennant (:p)
P Neville
Carlton Cole (:p)

not really dif. to sven's apart from subs. lot of upcoming youths though

[Nuclear Spoon]

King at right-bacK? What are you on? He's a center-back.
I think we'll be playing a weaker team against Azerbaijan anyhoo.

[dogincognito]

Hargreaves was coming on already, it wasn't a planned swap methinks.

yeah i meant for the game on Wednesday ;)


Shane, Neville was playing because he is easily England's best Rightback, and Butt because 1. Who else do we have in central midfield? and 2. For the 4-3-3 to work we need a defensive midfielder.

My ideal England side is:

---------------------Kirkland-------------

G.Neville-----Ferdinand----Campbell-----A. Cole

Beckham(c)---Gerrard---Lampard----Bridge

--------------Owen-----Rooney---------


But for Wednesday:

---------------------Green-------------

G.Neville-----Ferdinand----Campbell-----A. Cole

SWP----------Butt------Lampard----Jenas

--------------Owen-----Rooney---------

[jonffm]

You weren't so great, calm down. :p Chris is right.

Wales were fuckawful though. Very bad.

Wah? We played fast tempoed, great football.The finishing wasn't always there, and from the 45th to the 60th the game went abit dry, abut appart from that, you can't take anything away from england performance.

And Wales played pretty damn well if you ask me. They went out with a game plan and stuck to it. They managed to stay in a game against a team that well out-class them for the good part of 70 minutes, and one 4 or 5 occasions, really looked like scoring.

I dunno, maybe your football sence has been muled from watching too many disappointing scotland loses :P

Couldnt resist. :D

[Dingbat]

Wah? We played fast tempoed, great football.The finishing wasn't always there, and from the 45th to the 60th the game went abit dry, abut appart from that, you can't take anything away from england performance.

And Wales played pretty damn well if you ask me. They went out with a game plan and stuck to it. They managed to stay in a game against a team that well out-class them for the good part of 70 minutes, and one 4 or 5 occasions, really looked like scoring.

I dunno, maybe your football sence has been muled from watching too many disappointing scotland loses :P

Couldnt resist. :D

'Fast tempo'd, great football'? The game was dull!

Wales' game plan did not go well. How can you honestly say it did if they were outclassed for 70mins? Hartson was out of it, Bellamy was running all over the place with even more 'enthusiasm'/stupidity than Robbie Savage would've, and Ryan Giggs was all too easily subdued. They missed Savage, which was only so evident because Pembridge did nothing in his role, and their central defence was shakey. Though I will confess that both teams' wingers were subdued by the opponents' fullbacks, which probably took some excitement out of the match.

As for England: well, perhaps you've got the ol' rose tinted spectacles on again. They weren't BAD by any means, but neither were they as good as you claim. The central defence performed well and Rooney was good, but Owen was fairly anonymous and Defoe even more so. Butt was very dirty all game and was lucky not to be yellow-carded; Beckham was anonymous until that terrific goal, after which he started to fly into tackles with a bit too much fervour and subsequently got the stupid booking. Wayne Rooney was the only player who I really noticed in the game at all, and even he wasn't THAT great. You played better against France and lost IMO.

My man of the match would've been Paul Jones for pulling off some outstanding saves from the aforementioned wonderteen.

And to respond about your wee Scotland comment; I'm quite willing to admit Scotland were sub par AGAIN today. Our side is a shambles though, and we had plenty of injuries...plus only ten men. IMHO, Berti's last game should be today, as the likelihood is we'll beat Moldova and he'll be off the hook again.

Excuses? Blaming injuries and our foreign manager? Crikey, I've become one of you lot! ;)

[dogincognito]

DB@ Jonny may be biased, but so my friend are you :p

Azerbaijan 0-1 England

England's stand-in captain Michael Owen led from the front by heading the winner in the World Cup qualifier against Azerbaijan.


Owen, deputising for the injured and suspended David Beckham in Baku, stole in on Ashley Cole's cross to head home after 21 minutes. It strengthened England's position at the head of Group Six after a scrappy encounter in atrocious conditions.

Azerbaijan rarely threatened, with Emin Guliyev firing narrowly off target.
England coach Sven-Goran Eriksson opted for Newcastle's Jermaine Jenas as replacement for Beckham, and England almost got the perfect start when Owen met Gary Neville's cross, but could not find the target. Azerbaijan had been buoyed by home draws against Wales and Northern Ireland, and they came close to taking a shock lead after 11 minutes. Guliyev's long-range drive almost shocked Paul Robinson, drifting only inches wide. England took advantage of the escape to take the lead, courtesy of Owen, in the 21st minutes. Cole's measured cross to the far post was met by the unmarked Owen, who headed past Jahangir Hasanzade from eight yards.Wayne Rooney, who had been booked for a foul on Anatoly Ponomaryov, had an opportunity to extend England's lead five minutes before the interval when Hasanadze was harshly penalised for picking up a back-pass. Nicky Butt set Rooney up from close range, but his powerful drive rebounded to safety off the wall. Robinson had to be alert to dive at the feet of Samir Aliyev eight minutes after half-time when England struggled to clear a free-kick. But England responded with a threat of their own, Hasanzade looking uncertain as he turned a 30-yard free-kick from Frank Lampard over the top.
England coach Eriksson then made a switch, sending on Alan Smith for the subdued Jermain Defoe, as well as introducing Shaun Wright-Phillips for Jenas.
Rooney had worked hard in his deeper role, and he tested Hasanzade with another England free-kick, but the goalkeeper was equal to the task.
Azerbaijan enjoyed a greater share of possession in the closing stages, but England survived without any serious alarms.

Decent result, not a good performance but understandable considering the conditions...

[chicken_pie]

woooooooooo england, we won, but what a awful game, joe cole should be sacked, as for the Ireland game that i am watching as i speak in the hope mr Robbie Keane gets number 3, this game is awesome, miles better then englands, i'll be a very happy person if he does due to my 1/2 irishness, but england did get the points which is what counts, personnally i think they have become disjointed without Beckham

Edit: He didnt get the third, but thoroughly deserved it

[dogincognito]

My new England line up:
---------------------Kirkland-------------

G.Neville-----Ferdinand----Campbell-----A. Cole

Beckham(c)---Gerrard---Lampard-----Downing

--------------Owen-----Rooney---------

:D:cool:

[jonffm]

Heh, I agree with Downing. I just watched him for Middlesbrough and he was class. Definatly should be given a shot. Those crosses where world class.

[dogincognito]

Yeah he's improving with every game... Julian Gray is looking pretty good as well. Left wingers are like buses i reckon :D

[Tommuz]

Downing has been a real eye opener over recent weeks and that Willo Flood also looks very promising. However, I don't think Julian Gray isn't consistent enough, he drifts in and out of games all the time. Last year at Palace he had some absolutely blinding moments of brilliance only to be completely ineffective in the next game and just as often in the same game. Perhaps if he stayed with Palace under Dowie, that inconsistency might have gone like it's beginning to do with Routledge but still, he still impresses me on the odd occassion, just not last week when Boyce completely had him in his back pocket :D

Btw, despite being a Palace fan, I don't want AJ to play international footy yet because it would only cause too many problems, such as unwanted interest and an inevitable dip in form. Just look at Defoe since he's been in the England set up...

[dogincognito]

I think thtat's the kind of player Defoe is anyway, maybe a bit like Owen where he has a run where he's scoring for fun than dry spells =/ Needs the team he's in to be playing well also i think.

I don't know if Johnson is good enough for England, needs more time in the Premiership to show it.

Gray has played well this season against Chelsea, Newcastle and Manchester United, but he definitely does drift out of games sometimes. I think Downing is the better play at the moment, but it's nice to have two good young English left wingers playing in the Premiership :D

[chicken_pie]

downing?!?! baa, lee hendrie to the end

[dogincognito]

baa? you a sheep? :p

But i hope Hendrie makes the squad to play Spain, he's been in great form under David O' Leary and his goals this season are highlighting that :)

[chicken_pie]

Baa as in "baa humbug"

He's is more likly to make the squad for england - holland in febuary at Villa Park, although he will have to continue on his current scoring run, he had a few good shots against portsmouth on saturday, but when Villa have bolton he'll drive home 3, any money :rolleyes:

[Dingbat]

Yeah...but he's not very good, is he?

:D Only kidding.

Does he play on left midfield?

[chicken_pie]

centre midfield, but im sure he's adaptable :rolleyes:

although england have a real problem with the left hand side, but if gerrard is still out, hendrie would slot in his position nicley

[dogincognito]

England squad for Spain friendly::

Goalkeepers: Paul Robinson (Tottenham Hotspur), David James (Manchester City), Chris Kirkland (Liverpool)
Defenders: Ashley Cole (Arsenal), Matthew Upson (Birmingham City), Wayne Bridge (Chelsea), John Terry (Chelsea), Jamie Carragher (Liverpool), Rio Ferdinand (Manchester United) Gary Neville (Manchester United)
Midfielders: Phil Neville (Manchester United), Jermaine Jenas (Newcastle United), David Beckham (Real Madrid), Owen Hargreaves (Bayern Munich), Nicky Butt (Newcastle United), Joe Cole (Chelsea), Frank Lampard (Chelsea), Shaun Wright-Phillips (Manchester City)
Strikers: Wayne Rooney (Manchester United), Alan Smith (Manchester United), Michael Owen (Real Madrid), Jermain Defoe (Tottenham Hotspur)
-------------------------------------------
Same old same old :rolleyes:

Owen scored again today, and Beckham played the full 90 minutes without a problem, both played well :)
--------------------------------------------

Beckham 'to quit England in 2006'

England captain David Beckham says he will quit international football after the 2006 World Cup finals in Germany, according to reports.

The Real Madrid midfielder, 29, told the Daily Star he wants to play on at club level for several more years.

"The 2006 World Cup in Germany is probably as far as it will go for me as an England player," said Beckham.

Club-mates Zinedine Zidane and Luis Figo also gave up the international scene in their early thirties.


To be honest if he doesn't find better form for England I'd be suprised if he's first choice for the World Cup. On second thoughts I actually wouldn't :rolleyes:

Anyway it will probably be the right time for him to retire, 'cause he probably won't go the same way as Paul 'do nothing for years' Scholes.

[Sugar Ray]

But that's why I feel he is saying he is going to quit after the 2006 world cup. I think he realises that his position is getting more and more unsafe all the time. His performances have been very poor of late, and the public are backing Wright-Phillips more and more. He feels that by saying he's going to quit then it puts pressure on Sven to keep picking him, as it's soon to be his last tournament.......Awww. :)

[Thomp]

Ok people, teh night is here. What will teh score be?

I think 2-1 to england, but only just. Owen and Lampard to score, then Torres gets one back for a nervy last ten minutes. What do you guys think?

[Disgruntledgoat]

Lamps will score before the half hour, one of the spaniards will claw it back for a 1-1 leaving a tense few final ten minutes.

[Dingbat]

Spain will win 1-0, with Torres scoring.

I'm so bitter. ;)

[chicken_pie]

I have the fealing that spain may win, 1-0, but you never know with england, we could play well, or how we usually play... below par (shite)

[Cap'n Zola]

I've been a fan of Fernando Torres for a few years now, lets hope he's on form :p

[Shave]

some of the spanish fans are sick racist fucks to be honest. they shouting anytime shaun wright-phillips gets anywhere near the ball. if the english fa get fined for hooligansim the spanish fa should get fined for racism, and lets hope it's a lot

shit match also

[AngryPaul]

The Spanish fans are being severly racist.

Monkey chants anytime a black England player touches the ball.

Even deaf-ass Motson has heard them.

Something needs to be done.

Pitch also needs a water. Looks a bit hard. :rolleyes:

[da-geezer]

Fair play, I don't watch much football - just the champions league and some Serie A stuff. Thing is, I've not seen such a disgusting match for a while - surely someone can keep a cool head for an hour and a half for £50, 000 a week?

[jonffm]

Awful.

One of the worst matches i've ever had the displeasure of watching in my life. The only thing that put a grin on my face was switching through the channels with the game in the background and realising theres a Will and Grace double bill later.

The only thing that was worse than englands non-existant passing ability was the spanish fans, and not just a few of them based on the sheer volume, and their racist chants towards englands black players. It actually made me throw my can of stella at the TV...which was probably best because stellas fucking horrible.

If FIFA and the FA are really serious about their 'let's kick teh racism out of football!' prap, then they should actually try enforcing it with some substance. Rest assured, if that where england, we would be either rid of a few points from our world cup qualifying group, or the next match would be behind closed doors. Somehow I can't see anyone doing anything about it, mostly because FIFA have no fucking clue what the hell they are doing.

And lets not even get started on Butt. My god. How is this guy in an england shirt..no wonder manure got rid off him.

[Explosivo]

what was the end score? ive been too busy sorting laptops and stuff out to keep going downstairs to check on the score

[Dingbat]

what was the end score? ive been too busy sorting laptops and stuff out to keep going downstairs to check on the score
1-0 to Spain. Their left back scored.

Robinson saved a penalty that never was, and Rooney got taken off so he didn't get red carded.

[jonffm]

1-0.

Tip, do not watch the highlights...

In fact..it might be quite entertaining to see what tripe they could pick out of that 90 minutes that could justify the name 'highlights'.

[Explosivo]

1-0 to Spain. Their left back scored.

Robinson saved a penalty that never was, and Rooney got taken off so he didn't get red carded.

i saw that, it was a great save.

Still i think chris kirkland would be better in the goal than robinson, but at least robinson doing a better job than james

[Disgruntledgoat]

1-0 to the Spanish.

The best bit of the game in my opinion was Jonathan Woodgate's half time analysis:
Intwerviewer: "How can England get back into the game?"
JW: "Score some goals."

And the racism ruined the game as well. You could definitely see that Ashley Cole and Shaun Wright-Phillips were affected by it, especially in a stadium like the Bernebau(sp?).

[jonffm]

i saw that, it was a great save.

Still i think chris kirkland would be better in the goal than robinson, but at least robinson doing a better job than james

Naw. Us at Liverpool have done our usuall job on him.

Taken a goalkeeper with great potential and turned him into a nervous wreck.

We're quite proud of how many times we've managed to do that..it must be some kinda record..

[Chavvy]

If FIFA and the FA are really serious about their 'let's kick teh racism out of football!' prap, then they should actually try enforcing it with some substance. Rest assured, if that where england, we would be either rid of a few points from our world cup qualifying group, or the next match would be behind closed doors. Somehow I can't see anyone doing anything about it, mostly because FIFA have no fucking clue what the hell they are doing.
I couldn't have put it any better. :mad:

I've watched football for a looooong time now and I don't recall ever having the displeasure of seeing something like that. I have watched live and televised matches in the 80's where hooliganism (at least on the terraces) was more mainstream than it is now and I still wasn't subjected to the amount of racism that was evidently displayed tonight.

It sickens me. To the bottom of my stomach. Disgusting. :mad:

Who wants to bet that absolutely bugger all happens because of this match (which is a mirror of last night's under-21 match too - the same taunts were echoed there too). The FA simply stands for Fuck All; as in that's all that they will do.

Maybe someone should mail them a set of balls... they need them.

(I really want to eat my words on this and give praise to them IF they do anything about it, but in my heart of hearts I know they will "brush this under the carpet")

[jonffm]

I couldn't have put it any better. :mad:

I've watched football for a looooong time now and I don't recall ever having the displeasure of seeing something like that. I have watched live and televised matches in the 80's where hooliganism (at least on the terraces) was more mainstream than it is now and I still wasn't subjected to the amount of racism that was evidently displayed tonight.

It sickens me. To the bottom of my stomach. Disgusting. :mad:

Who wants to bet that absolutely bugger all happens because of this match (which is a mirror of last night's under-21 match too - the same taunts were echoed there too). The FA simply stands for Fuck All; as in that's all that they will do.

Maybe someone should mail them a set of balls... they need them.

(I really want to eat my words on this and give praise to them IF they do anything about it, but in my heart of hearts I know they will "brush this under the carpet")

Indeed.

However, the FA is still just run off politics and sneaky back-hand deals, if you know what I mean. (If you don't....my god o__O)

The under-21's where just as bad. But the sheer scale of it tonight was both sickening and pathetic.

I don't know about Spain, but here in England, racism in football, or even in everyday life, got stamped down to a very small minoritys a long time ago. I say 'if england did that' but that's just it..England WOULDN'T do that. If we ever do something like that, I'll never go to another game again.

A fine is'nt enough anyways. That will do nothing. You think these 'fans' (and I use the term loosly because they are not fans at all, they are racist thugs that are tarnishing their nations name) care about their national team getting abit of a fine? Yeah, right.

Next time that happens, the players should just take a stand. If I where Wright-Phillips, I would just have walked up to the Ref, registered a formal complaint, and just walked off the pitch. That would force the FA into taking action.

[dogincognito]

How to score past England.

Step 1: Win a corner

Step 2: Put that corner into the area.

Step 3: Shoot from the inevitable six yards of space you'll be given.


That was really shit. Their midfield played well but was physically weak, we should've used our strength to our advantage but we just let them knock the ball about.

There is no point in playing the full strenth team in friendlies with the relatively straight forward World Cup group we have the first team has plenty of time to gel. We might as well make use of friendlies to give young players a chance from the start, otherwise we'll never know what they can do agaisnt a good international side.

Rooney was criticised by Spain's Helguera last week as being unable to control himself. Seems like he wanted to prove him right :rolleyes: Throwing down the black armband was particularly moronic even for him.

Disgraceful stuff from some of the Spanish fans as well. Like Jonny said FIFA really should take strong action against Spain for the two counts of racism in two days, but they probably won't :rolleyes: These two games and the Spain coach's recent remarks about Thierry Henry certainly paint quite a sickening picture of Spanish football...

Edit:
Eriksson hits out at racist fans (http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/football/internationals/4018421.stm)
Is Spanish football racist? (http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/football/4019621.stm)

[streety]

I thought that the whole match was a disgrace.
The Racist chants...
Ashley "If you can't beat 'em kick 'em" Cole and his sidekick Gary "I'll Reyes my studs" Neville...
Rooney pushing Casillas...

To top it all off, Rooney throwing his black armband on the floor. This lad has no common sense.

I am ashamed to be English.

[dogincognito]

Meh, Reyes is a sly little bitch and deserves a kicking. What about when Reyes kicked Gary Neville and he just turned around and laughed at him, that was class :D It wouldn't be anything to do with Gary Neville being a Man utd player would it? :rolleyes:

Ashamed to be English? You'd rather be Spanish than would you, I'm sure they're proud of their "fans". And of half their team play acting (Fair play to those few who were more sporting than most players though)

[streety]

Meh, Reyes is a sly little bitch and deserves a kicking. What about when Reyes kicked Gary Neville and he just turned around and laughed at him, that was class :D It wouldn't be anything to do with Gary Neville being a Man utd player would it? :rolleyes:
No it was to do with the several challenges that he received from Neville. Not just in this match, in the premiership too. Reyes is twice the player that Neville is. He should've concentrated more on his football and less on incest.

Ashamed to be English? You'd rather be Spanish than would you
Errrr no...
There are not just 2 countries in the world.

[dogincognito]

Yeah but not one of them doesn't have morons among it's population.

Maybe you should be ashamed to be human :rolleyes:

[streety]

Who said I was human...
I'm dying for a pint of WD-40.

[Thomp]

Absolutely awful game. The racism was awful, and what I can't understand is why Rio and Jermaine Jenas weren't abused also.

What no-one has mentioned is Rooney. Now, he doesn't learn does he? He pushes Casillas into the crowd (who could've been seriously hurt), his yellow card was stupid, and throwing off his armband when he came off was a disgrace. I'm an Evertonian, but even so, to show that little respect to a great man, who had only been buried that day, was terrible. Shame on you Wayne.

[Sugar Ray]

Wayne Roony is nothing more than a chav. The fact that he earns more in a week than some people do in 5 years doesn't all of a sudden mean he has class. If he wasn't a footballer then where would he be? I'm sure we could all come up with suggestions. And on talkSport today, while some presenters were ripping right into him, others were defending him, using his age as an excuse. 60 years ago we had soldiers and fighter pilots fighting and dying at his age, so I don't see that as an excuse. He is a very lucky young man in that he has a great gift and will get paid alot to use it. But is he suddelny going to change when he is 21? I don't think so. He's an embarrasment to England, along with the team captain. Whatever happened to players with the skills and mentality of Butcher, Barnes, Lineker.....?

[jonffm]

Rooneys temperment isn't a problem at all. Once in a while, it boils over too much but last night, everyone was acting pathetic so you can't pinpoint a single player. It shows he has commitment and passion for the game, traits that have become rare in the english game knowdays. We needed a player like him at the last world cup, and he has shown how far he can get England by his preformances in Euro 04.

Most of that post really is shit sugar ray. Your simply laying into him because his temperment boiled over in one england game, and justifying that with some really crap military references. For one, what has how much money Rooney makes or his temperment have anything to do with people that where involved in world war 2? Nothing, at all. Compleate shit. Secondly, his age is an excuse. It's experience. It'll do him good so he can now move on. Why exactly can't he change? Let's look at Becks. 98 world cup, he was inexperienced. This ment he couldn't controll his anger and frustration which ended in a moment of stupidity that ultimatly cost England a place in the quarters. Now look at him. He's a model professional. You can bash his skills like every anti-becks sheep ever untill the cows come home, but you can't take away the fact that he's learnt, and grown.

You can be so ashamed by Englands patheticness, and long for the 'good ol days' when football players where characters and stand-up blokes, but at the end of the day, I'm glad that we arn't like nationssuch as Spain that appoints racist national coaches, and has fans that are as sickeningly racist as was displayed last night.


Finally. You can call rooney an 'embarrasment to England' as much as you like, but i'm pretty sure that if you went to any other country in the world and asked them if they wanted this so-called embarrasment on their national team, they would snatch him up like Michael Moore on a bowl of pork crackling. Why? Because he is probably the most talented youngster in the worldat the moment.

[Sugar Ray]

Because he is probably the most talented youngster in the world at the moment.


Compared to Adriano, Robben, Robihnio, Martins, Torres........ I think not. He has had one good game so far for Man Utd. Other than that he's dissapeared. I honestly do believe he'll be a £30million mistake. You say that every now and again he loses his temper, but his short career so far has been littered with nasty little incidents...... But history will tell.


And yes, let's look at Becks. He's a joke. The tattooed chav that is. His form has been poor for the past 18 months now, but he seems to have some hold over Sven. Sven has never and will never drop him, he has even admitted this! And of course this all come out with Becks telling everyone that he wasn't even fit for Euro 2004. Brilliant.






And if you are going to moan at me for a military referrence, then don't bring up one with Micheal Moore just because you are a damn Republican!

[Shave]

you can't look at his performance for Man U as the whole team haven't been playing well and there seems to be a goal drought. look what he did in the Euro's, he saved us on a number of occasions.

talking about young talent watch out for valerie bonjinov

[jonffm]

And yes, let's look at Becks. He's a joke. The tattooed chav that is. His form has been poor for the past 18 months now, but he seems to have some hold over Sven. Sven has never and will never drop him, he has even admitted this! And of course this all come out with Becks telling everyone that he wasn't even fit for Euro 2004. Brilliant.

And if you are going to moan at me for a military referrence, then don't bring up one with Micheal Moore just because you are a damn Republican!


If your going to moan at my Becks reference then actually read it first, because maybe then you would notice that I didn't actually mention his skill/form/place in the england team/relationship with Sven, and doing so is compleatly getting away from the point in question because you don't actually have an opinion backed up with any substance, just a few paragraphs of if's and but's, then try to sidetrack by bringing up my political stance.

:rolleyes:

[Sugar Ray]

If your going to moan at my Becks reference then actually read it first, because maybe then you would notice that I didn't actually mention his skill/form/place in the england team/relationship with Sven, and doing so is compleatly getting away from the point in question because you don't actually have an opinion backed up with any substance, just a few paragraphs of if's and but's, then try to sidetrack by bringing up my political stance.

:rolleyes:



Eh? Your point was that Becks was a model professional, after being a little bit feisty at the beginning of his career. I have disagreed. The only thing Beckham is interested in is making money for Beckham, whether it is through selling gel, shaving gear, japanese chocolate, adidas, pepsi, etc etc etc. Yes he's a model professional. Or is that a professional model?

[jonffm]

Why is he not a model professional? His form and skill have nothing to do with his professionalism whatsoever. Owens was probably one of the most professional players i've ever seen play while he was at Liverpool, but last season he was well below his usuall standards. By your reasoning that means he's a crap professional, and is only in the game for the money and advertising campaigns with crap sports drinks, which i'm sorry but is utter bollocks.

Every player goes through bad patches. The reason he's still in the Real and England squad even when he's playing poor is simply because players don't get over bad spells if you strip them of their first team status. That does nobody good. How is he ever going to get back to form if he is just sitting his arse on the bench? He isn't.

It amazes me how quickly fans, especially in the English game turn their backs on players as soon as they are not turning in an assist or a 30-yard goal every game.

[Sugar Ray]

Look, I have never liked Beckham, and I'm certainly not an England fan. As far as his professianlism is concerned, I don't think you can compare him to a former England captain I mentioned earlier. There's a man who would sweat blood for his country, and treated each training session like it was the world cup final. Beckham is more interested about having his most recent haircut and dimond earings on display.

[jonffm]

Look, I have never liked Beckham, and I'm certainly not an England fan. As far as his professianlism is concerned, I don't think you can compare him to a former England captain I mentioned earlier. There's a man who would sweat blood for his country, and treated each training session like it was the world cup final. Beckham is more interested about having his most recent haircut and dimond earings on display.

Exactly who are you to question Beckhams loyalty? Have you ever actually researched your little opinions or bothered actually attempting to see if from any other point of view other than someone who is obviously bias against him? Have you ever seen him train? Have you ever met the guy? Do you actually know anything on the subject other than what you've read in some crap tabloid newspaper? I really doubt it. Youa ctually know nothing on the subject, you're just making bias, unfounded, and frankly quite untrue statements about a player that you dislike, simply out of spite.

I'm not even gunna bother with this anymore, simply because it's pointless. It's a difference in opinion on something hat can never be proved, and most people don't even question. That and the fact your just making assumptions about the guy simply because he does alot of advertising and wears expencive jewlery.

[Sugar Ray]

Yes it is a difference of opinion. Well done for noticing that. I don't like him, you do. I think he doesn't bring much to the England team, you do. I think he is a poor choice for captian, you think he is......... meh.

[jonffm]

Don't try to be sarcastic.

This is like debating if god exists. Nobody ever going to prove it, and even though many people agree with it, it doesn't mean it's true, but hell. All that's going to happen is the same argument is gunna be taken, chewed up a little, reworded slightly, then re-posted. So whats the point?

[Sugar Ray]

Stop Already!

[Dingbat]

*sigh* :rolleyes: England fans...fighting even amongst themselves.

:p

Just poking fun. ;)

[Sugar Ray]

Where? :ninja:


and I'm certainly not an England fan.

[Nuclear Spoon]

Do you actually know anything on the subject other than what you've read in some crap tabloid newspaper?

Err. The tabloids are crap yes. They say Beckham is good. Beckham's good on his day anyway.

And can anyone tell me why the hell Butt played the full 90 minutes? As far as I could see, he did fuck all to contribute to us playing something near pub football.

[jonffm]

Butt is bloody awful. I've never seen him play well for england, god knows why he's there. I counted 8 instances in a row where the second he got the ball, he gave it away. About 20 minutes and he only compleated about 1 or 2 passes, the rest went straight to the opposition.

[dogincognito]

I've seen him play well for England, against Argentina 02 he was absolutely sublime. But that's about it, he's a good player and should be in the squad, but if we can't play Gerrard and Lampard next in line should be Hargreaves he is an excellent player- pace, technique, power, tackling, tenacity, vision....and he plays in the Champions League for Bayern year in year out.

[PJ]

How about Shaun-Wright Phillips toghnight.
He deserves a place in the England first team as he plays like that week in and week out.
The replacment Pompey keeper is class. He deserves a try aswell.

[Dingbat]

How about Shaun-Wright Phillips toghnight.
He deserves a place in the England first team as he plays like that week in and week out.
The replacment Pompey keeper is class. He deserves a try aswell.
Might I point out that England don't just hand out callups left, right and centre like Berti Vogts did? :)

[dogincognito]

Shaun Wright-Phillips needs to improve his crossing, then he will be worthy of an England starting place.

We used to DB@, Michael Ricketts!? :shock:;)

[Nuclear Spoon]

Is there anyone here who thinks that our players need a winter break? I think it would be a very good idea, because it tires the pants out of players and they get pneumonia.
Made a petition if anyone wants, and pass it onto others: http://www.petitiononline.com/mod_perl/signed.cgi?wb4fl

[dogincognito]

I think a winter break could be good but is not really as neccessary here as in other European countries..
And I don't think online petition's really make any difference to anything =/

[dogincognito]

Eriksson drops hint over Downing
England coach Sven-Goran Eriksson said Middlesbrough's Stewart Downing will make his international debut next year - if he maintains his impressive form.

The 20-year-old has been tipped to fill in on England's problematic left side.

"If he goes on like this then we should give him a chance, certainly in the friendly game against Holland in February," Eriksson told Sky Sports.

"I think he deserves that but it's December. We will see what happens in February. But he is very impressive."

Eriksson was at St Mary's to watch Boro's 2-2 draw with Southampton on Saturday, where Downing scored a spectacular last-minute equaliser.

"I didn't know Sven was there watching but hopefully I impressed him in some way," Downing told the Evening Gazette.

"The England stuff doesn't affect me at all. I've spoken to the gaffer once or twice before about it and he's told me there's nothing more I can do.

"I've just got to continue playing well and see what happens."

The 20-year-old has played regularly for the England Under-21s but is yet to turn out for the senior side.

Eriksson has also been impressed with Chelsea centre-back John Terry - but cannot guarantee him a starting place ahead of Rio Ferdinand and Sol Campbell.

"It's extremely hard to play central defence for England if we have all our defenders fit. I hope Jonathan Woodgate will start to play for Real Madrid, so then we have one more," added Eriksson.

"I'm very happy about the situation, it's good and we'll see what is happening."

Should England qualify for the World Cup in 2006, Eriksson is hoping to have an extra week with his squad to prepare for the tournament.

"Going into a major tournament is different because you have a long season behind you and you have too little time to rest and have preparation," he said.

"That was our problem in Japan and Portugal. I hope we have one week more in Germany."
:cool:
*Does happy dance*

[streety]

Downing should be starting in the England team and not just in the squad. He is an amazing talent. Ding Dang Doo!

[Sugar Ray]

What's this? An attacking left sided midfielder. AND he's English? I don't believe it. But then Sven will probably play him for one game and the drop him for Nicky Butt.

[Chavvy]

What's this? An attacking left sided midfielder. AND he's English? I don't believe it. But then Sven will probably play him for one game and the drop him for Nicky Butt.Quoted for the truthy bits...

When was the last time we had any real talent down the left wing (don't even think about McMananananananananananananaman). Yet he's overlooked again and again. Sven can't say he doesn't play him because of his age because Rooney plays (and he's about 12) and it certainly can't be because of the lack of talent... So why?

Let's all hope he has an absolute blinder and is a first choice selection. \o/

[dogincognito]

I wouldn' say McManaman due to the fact he's a right winger. But was a top class player, thanks.

[dogincognito]

I have a new England team:
-------------Robinson-----------
Neville---Terry---Ferdinand----Cole
------------Hargreaves--------------
------Gerrard (c)----Lampard-------
SWP---------------------------Downing
--------------Owen-----------------

Ok so tactics half-inched from Chelsea but that is a class team :cool:

[Sk£tch]

-------------Robinson-----------
Neville---Terry---Ferdinand----Cole
------------------------------------------
-------Lampard----Gerrard (c)-------
SWP---------------------------Downing
----------Owen---Defoe--------------

That would be mine. Beckham does not deserve any more caps, and SWP and Downing have pace and would actually push forward instead of sat defending and letting other teams hammer us.

Rooney is overrated in my opinion.

[streety]

3-5-2 FORMATION
--------------------Robinson--------------------
-------Ferdinand----Terry----Campbell--------
Wright-Phillips----------------------------A Cole
------Beckham-----Lampard-----Gerrard-------
--------------Owen--------Rooney--------------

REASONING
We have 4 world class centre backs at present, Terry, Campbell, Ferdinand and Woodgate. Terry is currently 3rd choice but with his performances this season he deserves to be in the starting 11.

Both wide players are fast, attacking have players in close positions that could cover if needed. Beckham and Gerrard are both good in the tackle and run all day. The 3 centre midfielder's all have an amazing range of passing and are all good going forward and defending.

I can't believe that people are saying that Rooney shouldn't start. He was our best player at Euro 2004 even if his league form isn't good. Teams are scared of him and he can produce something out of nothing. Owen is currently playing well for Real Madrid and warrents a place in the team.

If a substitution is needed there is cover in all areas of the pitch.
Robinson --> Kirkland
Ferdinand, Terry or Campbell --> Woodgate or Carragher
Wright Phillips --> Hargreaves or Beckham
A Cole --> Bridge or Downing
Beckham, Lampard or Gerrard --> Butt, Hargreaves or Jenas
Rooney or Owen --> Defoe or Heskey

All we need to do now is get rid of that twat in charge and appoint McClaren.

[Thomp]

I'd probably play Downing head of Cole, only because Cole, although playing well, isn't a regular in the Chelski side and when I've seen him for England he hasn't been at his best.

I'd give Downing an opportunity to see how well he can play

[streety]

I'd probably play Downing head of Cole, only because Cole, although playing well, isn't a regular in the Chelski side and when I've seen him for England he hasn't been at his best.

I'd give Downing an opportunity to see how well he can play
I should've put the word Ashely in there... Sorry.
Cole is a fat cockney twat [/disgruntled liverpool fan]

[Sugar Ray]

Eriksson has now dropped the hint that he will be playing Shaun Wright Phillips on the left!!! Saying that he believes he is a good enough player to play in a completely different position. Or, is it just that Sven is so scared of telling Beckham that he is in risk of losing his place to SWP as his recent (18months) performances haven't justified being picked. Also, where does this leave Downing? The only left sided midfielder, and one who deserves a place. Why can't he play Downing and SWP in the same team?????

[streety]

I stick by my 352 formation. Beckham is a talented footballer and brings the best out of other players. His passing is second to none alonso and he is deadly from set pieces. I would have him in the team but hand over the captaincy to Gerrard.

[dogincognito]

So, Holland next week. I'd like to see Downing, SWP and Johnson given a chance.

[streety]

Apparently they all will be given a chance. I still stick by the 3-5-2 formation although it looks likely that we will play a 4-4-2 with Campbell out.

Probable Team?
--------------Robinson-----------------
Neville----Terry-----Ferdinand-----Cole
---------------------------------------
---------Lampard----Gerrard------------
Beckham----------------------------SWP
-----------Owen----Rooney--------------

My Team
--------------------Robinson--------------------
-------Ferdinand-----Terry-----King------------
Wright-Phillips----------------------------A Cole
------Beckham-----Lampard-----Gerrard-------
--------------Owen--------Rooney--------------

[Tommuz]

Sorry, what was that?

So, Holland next week. I'd like to see Downing, SWP and Johnson given a chance.

:love:

I would like to see him given a half at least. It's only a friendly so what does it matter if we lose? I'm sure SWP will be playing and Downing is more than probable too.

The team I would play would be



---------------Robinson---------------
-Neville---King-----Ferdinand----Cole-
--------------------------------------
---------------Gerrard----------------
---SWP----------------------Downing---
------Defoe----Johnson----Rooney------



Not that Sven would dare to try that formation.

[streety]

Have you got something against Chelsea? Where's Terry and Lampard?

[Tommuz]

Just picking a team that is fairly strong but primarily for giving people a run out to see how they cope. Although might swap Ferdinand for Terry looking at it again but thats it. Obviously for a competitive game the squad would look completely different.

[Nuclear Spoon]

Our central defense is FUCKED, officially.

Campbell, Ferdinand, Woodgate, Terry, King and a few others are all out. Now we have to consider Carragher and Wes Brown. I don't mind Carragher, it's Brown I don't like. I think he's a bit shit IMO.

Team for Holland:

Robinson
G Neville Carragher Brown Cole
Beckham (SWP 45m) Lampard Gerrard Downing
Defoe Rooney

Give Defoe at least a half.

[Thomp]

No Terry or King?! Oh bloody hell. I'd play this team:

Robinson
G.Neville
Carragher
Brown
A.Cole
SWP
Lampard
Gerrard
Downing
Owen
Johnson


Yes, Andy Johnson, cos he is class and possibly the best attacker I've seen for a struggling team this season

[Explosivo]

I was informed that Terry and King would both be playing in Central Defence. My england team would be

Robinson
Terry King
Beckham SWP Downing Cole
Lampard Gerrard
Johnson
(45 min then Rooney Owen or defoe or replace a mid field with a striker)


Not really an Authentic formation or set or players, but i'd give johnson a go, and with our defence injury list id have those to (if they not playing then brown and carragher)
Im not playing nevile cos i personally think hes shite.

I think Downing and SWP will work well together and if we play Gerrard and Lampard in a Much more attacking postition surely only more goals can come of it

[PJ]

After the match against chelsea i think james deserves a frendly at least.

James
(45 minutes then on comes robinson)
Terry--- King---- Carragher---- Neville
SWP---- Gerrard---- Lampard---- Downing
Rooney------ Defoe
(Defoe off for owen at half time)

[dogincognito]

The problem with David James is although he is an outstanding keeper on his day you know he will always make a mistake at some point.
Robinson
Neville----Brown :(-----Carragher-----Cole
SWP-----Gerrard----Hargreaves-----Downing
Johnson-------Defoe

[Shave]

wooyay. leory lita of bristol city has been called up to the U21s squad \o/

other note: at least holland don't have robben

[AngryPaul]

The TWAT is still gunna play SWP on the left. I mean come on, this is a chance to experiement and he isn't taking the chance at all!

He has no daring attitude in him, he won't take a risk - which I think it isn't - to play to debutants on the wings:

Robinson

G.Neville---Carragher---Brown--:eek:-A.Cole

Wright-Phillips----Gerrard---------Downing

Lampard

--------------Owen-------------------------
----------------------------Rooney---------

[dogincognito]

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/football/internationals/4246397.stm

'kin hell. Didn't see that one coming.

[Dingbat]

"Shaun Wright-Phillips will probably start the game," said Eriksson. "But I'm not going to start Wright-Phillips on the left."

So he's possibly going to play in central midfield, actually. The BBC have simply presumed that he'll play on the right, but I doubt it. Sven hasn't said that he'll start him on the right, he's merely said he won't start him on the left.

He might play him just behind the strikers, with Downing on the left.

[dogincognito]

"Probably Shaun Wright-Phillips will start to the right," said Eriksson.

[Dingbat]

"Probably Shaun Wright-Phillips will start to the right," said Eriksson.
See, that quote wasn't on BBC until a few minutes ago, it was originally what I put up there.

Oh well :confused:

[dogincognito]

:confused:

hopefully that is where he will start anyway... I wonder if Beckham will be dropped or someone else will be to accomodate him =/

[Dingbat]

My predicted team:

http://img237.exs.cx/img237/5489/tonightsteam8bq.png

[dogincognito]

I really hope Sven doesn't play Beckham in the centre. He played there for Real and that's why he's been so crap but now he's on the right for them and is starting to look good again.

[AngryPaul]

The England coach is also expected to start with David Beckham on the right of a three-man midfield.

Wright-Phillips could then play to the right of a three-pronged attack, alongside Michael Owen and Wayne Rooney as part of a 4-3-3 formation. Hmmm.....

I hope that doesnt happen. SWP is a winger, not a striker

If he were to play a 4-3-3 I'd like to see Defoe/Johnson up with Rooney and Owen.

I'd rather the 4-3-1-2 formation I said earlier.

[Thomp]

Definitely play SWP in a attacking midfield role behind the front two, as it means that he is playing a free role (virtually) and it means he has the whole midfield to cover so he could move to the left wing if Lampard goes into the centre

[Disgruntledgoat]

Actually this could work very well I think.

Rooney playing from the left, SWP playing the right (he seems to have done quite well when playing up front with Man City) and feeding Owen in the middle.

Only problem is the midfield is also quite attack-minded. If anything, we need another Nicky Butt, but obviously, better. Someone who just holds the attack up (bit like Claude Makelele does for Chelsea.

For once, I can see this working. Defoe I think is too similar to Owen, who is much more of a pouncer, whereas Rooney and SWP can feed them in or go alone.

But then again, I could be talking total rubbish.

[Dingbat]

I'm surprised, nobody has mentioned the match yet.

Rather unconvincing, even if I say it.

[Tommuz]

I think what the pundits were saying last night was pretty much spot on. That game was a waste of time and Sven needs to sort out his tactical decisions big time. If you're going to play new players, play them in their correct positions, otherwise whats the point?

Thought it was quite obvious with Sven's comments after the match that AJ was just a token player given his form in the premiership. Surely the fact that AJ has scored so many goals for Palace should mean even more? Obviously not though and no doubt if he was at any other club other than Palace, Norwich or WBA, he would have been given more respect.

[Thomp]

I'm never getting those two hours left EVER.

That game was a shambles, I could have spent time talking to people on MSN or doing work. Downing and Johnson looked completely lost in their positions, and Owen is a waste of space. Rooney and Johnson number one strikers now

[jonffm]

Why.

Why why why why why why WHY.

For one, even if we do have injurys, if Wes Brown is the ebst we can come up with...my god. He's not even good enough to warm the bench at Man U, so how the hell was he there?! get an under-21's in instead.

Downing and Johnson where both pretty much raped in the ass by Sven as usuall. Whats the point. You play them from the start, not half way through the second half...and Hargreaves(sp?)...why?!

I've already lost all confidence in Sven...i'm really questioning why he's still in charge. Sam Alladyce or Harry Redknapp deserve the position, and would be a huge step-up for the nation IMO...why have a Swedish nonse who doesn't seem to understabd international football over two world-class ENGLISH managers? I'm pretty sure neither would turn the position down.

*sighs*

World cup 2006...god help us all.

[dogincognito]

Allardyce or Redknapp would be dreadful England managers.

Sven completly wasted a great chance to try out some new players, played a dumbass formation and made pointless subs. Why not play players in their best positionsgrrrr :mad::mad:

What really gets me is we have one of our best young squads for a long time, so one of our best chances to win the world cup but we'll have Sven in charge :mad:
Sven out =/

[streety]

Glad i didn't watch it :)

[Dingbat]

For one, even if we do have injurys, if Wes Brown is the ebst we can come up with...my god. He's not even good enough to warm the bench at Man U, so how the hell was he there?! get an under-21's in instead.


Brown played alright actually. There were worse players you could have had on - Gareth Southgate, anyone? Don't blame him for putting Brown there.


Downing and Johnson where both pretty much raped in the ass by Sven as usuall. Whats the point. You play them from the start, not half way through the second half...and Hargreaves(sp?)...why?!

True. Hargreaves should only play when Gerrard's injured.

I've already lost all confidence in Sven...i'm really questioning why he's still in charge. Sam Alladyce or Harry Redknapp deserve the position, and would be a huge step-up for the nation IMO...why have a Swedish nonse who doesn't seem to understabd international football over two world-class ENGLISH managers? I'm pretty sure neither would turn the position down.

Neither would be OFFERED it. Doggy is quite right. Harry Redknapp, world-class? Southampton aren't exactly doing 'world-class' right now, are they? As for Allardyce, granted Bolton are a decent team, but I still don't think he'd be a good England manager.

I think Sven is pretty much all you've got, and all you're GOING to get. He's not going to leave for a good while yet. Hopefully he'll learn ONE thing from tonight: 4-3-3 does not work and his selection was poor.

Complain about him all you want, things won't change.

Having said that - if Andy Johnson never wins another England cap, it'll be a disgrace.

[jonffm]

"Having said that - if Andy Johnson never wins another England cap, it'll be a disgrace."

..Why? he's a class player. He turns out 110% every week for palace, and is valuable asset to the team when used correctly, not stuck out on the wing.

Redknapp in my opinion would be a class english manager. One, he's probably the best english manager there is at the moment, and even if he is'nt as good as Sven (which I think is bollocks, because Svens no Bobby Robson himself) at least he's ENGLISH, and isn't that what international footballs meant to be about?

Southamptons current form? Did you actually watch the Everton game? Anyone that watches that along with the preformance against liverpool (given, we did play very badly) and still takes shots at their 'current form' frankly, knows less about football than my Nan. Which is abit, but not alot.

You can't compleatly judge a manager on their teams form, otherwise a week ago, Benitez was a terrible manager, Sven was just as bad, Wenger was average...the list goes on.

[PJ]

You can't compleatly judge a manager on their teams form, otherwise a week ago, Benitez was a terrible manager, Sven was just as bad, Wenger was average...the list goes on.
Kevin Keegan is an exellent manager if thats the truth.

Anyway i was appauled how we played, but Shauny still played well.
I do belive someone said "Shaun Wright phillips wont get a cap as hes got to much competion for his spot." Balls. Backham cant play recently.

[Dingbat]

"Having said that - if Andy Johnson never wins another England cap, it'll be a disgrace."

..Why? he's a class player. He turns out 110% every week for palace, and is valuable asset to the team when used correctly, not stuck out on the wing.


Exactly. :confused:


Redknapp in my opinion would be a class english manager. One, he's probably the best english manager there is at the moment, and even if he is'nt as good as Sven (which I think is bollocks, because Svens no Bobby Robson himself) at least he's ENGLISH, and isn't that what international footballs meant to be about?

Southamptons current form? Did you actually watch the Everton game? Anyone that watches that along with the preformance against liverpool (given, we did play very badly) and still takes shots at their 'current form' frankly, knows less about football than my Nan. Which is abit, but not alot.

You can't compleatly judge a manager on their teams form, otherwise a week ago, Benitez was a terrible manager, Sven was just as bad, Wenger was average...the list goes on.

Redknapp is not the best English manager out there right now, Sam Allardyce is. And no, international football is about 11 players playing for the pride of their nation. Having a good manager helps, but whether he's from your country or not is irrelevant. Look at Greece.

Southampton have recently added to their team. Redknapp wouldn't be able to do that. Could he still really be a great manager when he didn't have the freedom to make his own squad? I don't think so. And don't insult my footballing knowledge...even though very often with you, this seems to be the claim you aim at me all the time...:(

[dogincognito]

Sam Allardyce is an ok manager but for England he would be whack. Long balls, constant fouls to stop opposition playing, wouldn't work at international level and even if it did why would we want it?

Redknapp is a wheeler dealer, he doesn't know shit about bringing through young players, why do you think Pompey got rid?


The only candidate at the moment would be McClaren =/
Maybe Dowie could be when he has some more experience at a bigger club.

[jonffm]

It doesn't matter if Greece won the thing with a manager that wasn't Greek, it's totally irrelivent. I still think that a national team should represent the best talent available to that country, both on and off the pitch. The manager plays just as big a part as the players, and so should at least be loosly related to the nationality in my opinion. I would muchr ather england won something under an English manager than a lanky swedish potato.

Sammy and Harry are both class managers. One, just because Sammy adopts those tactics for Bolton, it doesn't mean he would do the same for England. We all know he only uses those tactics because of the lack of talent available...any team that could call Diouff a star player deserves pity. Two, Pompy got rid? Like bollocks they did. If pompy had the chance, he would have stayed untill the end of his career. He's a class talent. He did wonders for West Ham and Pompy, and given time, I think he'll do the same for Southampton..in fact, he's already started. They're only docking points by some very bad luck, and the odd awefull preformance. They just need abit more luck, and alot more consistancy.

Kevin Keegan is an exellent manager if thats the truth.

No other sentence could prove that theory more.

[Dingbat]

It doesn't matter if Greece won the thing with a manager that wasn't Greek, it's totally irrelivent. I still think that a national team should represent the best talent available to that country, both on and off the pitch. The manager plays just as big a part as the players, and so should at least be loosly related to the nationality in my opinion. I would muchr ather england won something under an English manager than a lanky swedish potato.

It's funny how when it comes around to the World Cup, people will mention Greece and the fact that they won Euro 2004 with such long odds, and take heart from that for England; yet right now, it's irrelevant, even though it's also related. And I don't think it's very nice to call him a 'lanky Swedish potato' - you're going to have to support his team for the next three years or so.

Sammy and Harry are both class managers. One, just because Sammy adopts those tactics for Bolton, it doesn't mean he would do the same for England. We all know he only uses those tactics because of the lack of talent available...

We do?

any team that could call Diouff a star player deserves pity.

So Liverpool two years ago? :p

Two, Pompy got rid? Like bollocks they did. If pompy had the chance, he would have stayed untill the end of his career. He's a class talent. He did wonders for West Ham and Pompy, and given time, I think he'll do the same for Southampton..in fact, he's already started. They're only docking points by some very bad luck, and the odd awefull preformance. They just need abit more luck, and alot more consistancy.

And this is the man you would want as manager of your NATIONAL team? Redknapp prefers to make his own team through a blend of new signings and sometimes young blood, as well as the existing players. Look at Southampton signing four people in the transfer window, it's already begun.

Maybe McLaren or Steve Bruce (http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/football/teams/b/birmingham_city/4257233.stm) would be a better pick, IMO. They're younger managers and as such are really more suited to it. As far as Sven goes, complain all you like, but your replacements offered wouldn't be good England managers from what I can see.

[jonffm]

It's funny how when it comes around to the World Cup, people will mention Greece and the fact that they won Euro 2004 with such long odds, and take heart from that for England; yet right now, it's irrelevant, even though it's also related. And I don't think it's very nice to call him a 'lanky Swedish potato' - you're going to have to support his team for the next three years or so.


One, I don't give a crap what people say..what's that got to do with it? It's irrelivent to me because one, England and Greece arn't quite the same thing now are we. We may be an outside team, but Greece are something else. I won't take any heart from Euro 2004's result..why would I take heart from the fact us so-called top world teams where humiliated by the second-to-last faves and made to look the overpaid prats we know most of them have become. If anything, it makes me despair about what's going to happen in the World cup, because with Sven's policys of playing the hollywood players rather than the GOOD players, we don't stand a hope in hell. I'm not going to lie about it and pretend that I think we're going to win the thing, because hounestly, I really don't at the moment. I'll get behind the team, but if we're still using the same tactics, same glamour models and the same mentality, then it'll show how little Svens learnt from his two failed attempts.

And why not? Just because he's manager of our national team doesn't mean I have to like him. I've never liked Sven, i've tolerated him when he was making good managerial and tactic decisions, but he's not now. Two games with the 4-3-3, and both have been the worst preformances i've seen for England in my LIFE. If he plays it again, i'll lose the tiny stand of faith I still have in him.

We do?

Do you disagree? Do you really think Bolton have the talent to push forward into attack every game? No. They don't. They have maybe..2-3 good players, that's it. They don't have the talent to do anything else, and it works pretty damn well. If it aint broke..

So Liverpool two years ago?

He wasn't that bad a player two years ago, but he was certainly never a star player. Only Gerrard, Owen, Hamman, Hyypia, Dudek (when he was good), and Mourientes, Carra, possibly Baros and maybe Alonso could be called star players in the past few years.


And this is the man you would want as manager of your NATIONAL team? Redknapp prefers to make his own team through a blend of new signings and sometimes young blood, as well as the existing players. Look at Southampton signing four people in the transfer window, it's already begun.

Is that not what we need? A manager with the guts to field the players HE wants, not the players he thinks he SHOULD play. I think Beckhams days would be numbered with Redknapp in charge, which would do the whole team a world of good.

Maybe McLaren or Steve Bruce would be a better pick, IMO. They're younger managers and as such are really more suited to it. As far as Sven goes, complain all you like, but your replacements offered wouldn't be good England managers from what I can see.

Not so sure about Bruce, but McLaren I would also have no trouble with. Either of them, I wouldn't be upset about. Either of the 4 managers mentioned could do just as good, if not better a job than Sven, and what's more, they're English, which I stand by my views and say is MUCH better.

To be honest, your opinion on Redknapps value doesn't seem to carry much weight. I've always followed Redknapp, met him a couple of times too, bloody nice chap, and I think he is one of the best managers England has to offer. How he deals in the transfer market doesn't matter, because at the end of the day, he always gets the job done. He's taken two pretty average teams and turned them both into Premiership standard Mid-tablers. West ham where a force to be reckoned with in their day, and Pompy are pretty good, and Southampton can only get better...He's a class manager, there's no two-ways about it, and I would love to see what would happen if real class players where given to him.

Besides, at least if nobody thinks he's up for it, if he does ever get the job, there would be no pressure to suceed, because alot of people like yourself would have made your judgements before he even started.

[dogincognito]

Sammy and Harry are both class managers. One, just because Sammy adopts those tactics for Bolton, it doesn't mean he would do the same for England. We all know he only uses those tactics because of the lack of talent available...any team that could call Diouff a star player deserves pity..He buys players to fit that system.... if he wanted he could do differently :rolleyes:
Using your personal grudges against certain players hardly strengthens your argument either.



Two, Pompy got rid? Like bollocks they did. If pompy had the chance, he would have stayed untill the end of his career. Quite laughable. Were you hiding in a cave with your fingers in your ears when he left?

He did wonders for West Ham and Pompy,
yes, through his wheeling and dealing in the transfer market. As a coach he is nothing special.

[dogincognito]

England squad:

Goalkeepers: David James (Manchester City), Paul Robinson (Tottenham Hotspur), Robert Green (Norwich City).

Defenders: John Terry (Chelsea), Rio Ferdinand (Manchester United), Ledley King (Tottenham Hotspur), Jamie Carragher (Liverpool), Ashley Cole (Arsenal), Gary Neville (Manchester United), Wes Brown (Manchester United), Phil Neville (Manchester United).

Midfielders: Stewart Downing (Middlesbrough), Owen Hargreaves (Bayern Munich, Germany), Joe Cole (Chelsea), Steven Gerrard (Liverpool) Frank Lampard (Chelsea), Kieron Dyer (Newcastle United), Jermaine Jenas (Newcastle United), David Beckham (Real Madrid, Spain).

Forwards: Wayne Rooney (Manchester United), Andy Johnson (Crystal Palace) Michael Owen (Real Madrid, Spain), Jermain Defoe (Tottenham Hotspur), Emile Heskey (Birmingham City).


Emile!!! :D
Finally he's back. Average Johnson shouldn't be there imo, he's too similar to Defoe and Owen without being as good as either.

Against Northern Ireland I'd play:
-----------------Robinson------
Neville-----Carra-------King--------Cole
Beckham--Hargreaves--Cole--Downing
-------------Owen------Rooney-----

Hargreaves holding role allowing Joe Cole to tear them apart :cool:

Although more likely is Sven will play the same team as usual and England will get a workmanlike 2-0 victory, both goals in the second half. Followed by days and days of criticism for the management team.

[Chavvy]

Hahahah Emile Heskey... Hahahahah... Er how about NO??

My predicted team:

-----------------Robinson------
Chuckle Brother--Carra---Terry-----Cole
Beckham--Gerrard--Lampard--Downing
-------------Owen------Rooney-----

Score prediction?? Well as it's my birthday on Saturday I say 5-0 to Ingerlund (Owen hatrick)....

I thank you...

[Thomp]

I think Emile deserves his chance again really, he has been playing well. My team would be:

Robinson
G.Neville
A.Cole
Carragher
Ferdinand
SWP
Downing
Gerrard
J.Cole
Rooney
Owen

[Chavvy]

I think Emile deserves his chance again really, he has been playing well.

/me slaps Thomp with a big trout.

[Thomp]

*slap chavvy back with two pilchers*

Come on, I have disliked him in the past, but I think he's been good at birmingham

[dogincognito]

He's great! The Heskalator!

Well maybe not great but deserving of a squad place. He's our only (decent) striker with any sort of physical presence.

[Evil Egg]

SWP
I believe he's injured, and out for the rest of the season. Something like that could have a pretty bad effect on his performance :p

[Thomp]

Silly me for not remembering...then it will have to be Beckham (lucky I'd say)

[Sk£tch]

Ah, Emile Heskey, everyones favourite England striker. I believe his goals to games ratio is roughly one in five. Hardly prolific, is he?

[jonffm]

*Prays for no 4-3-3*

God help us if he does. We'll probably even lose to the Irish..........*shudder*

We should slaughter them both. Becks, Owen, Heskey, Cole, they all have something to prove, so bad preforamces from them wouldn't come at the best of times.

[Disgruntledgoat]

You gotta admire Sven really.

He said it wasn't the end of his England days when he dropped Heskey from the team, and true to his word, he's brought him back.

We need more benchwarmers like him these days.

EDIT: Predictioneriser

-----------------Robinson-------------
-G. Neville--Terry--Ferdinand--A. Cole-
-Beckham--Gerrard--Lampard--J. Cole-
-------------Rooney----Owen---------

[Nuclear Spoon]

Robbo
Neville King Terry A.Cole
Beckham J.Cole Gerrard Downing
Defoe Owen

I said Defoe mainly because I support Spurs, but also I think he deserves more international experience.

[jonffm]

Defoe and Johnson are going to be talents wasted, because being realistic, they're never going to out-place Owen or Rooney.

Not a bad couple of benchers though.

[Disgruntledgoat]

Johnson's out of the squad:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/football/internationals/4373131.stm

Ankle injury.

[dogincognito]

What a shame. :rolleyes:

[chicken_pie]

well looks like cyrstal palace are going down then

just out of interest does anyone else think that Sven can retain the record of losing no qualifiers, because after looking at the recent away form, in the last 5 there have been 3 draws and 2 loses, and no wins (bit like Villa really)

[Nuclear Spoon]

Oh hurrah. A new England kit. Again. I laugh at anyone who buys a new England kit every time it comes out. Nothing special. Looks kinda shite with just one red stripe on the shoulder.

[Sk£tch]

Anyone going to see the England U21's V Germany U21's on Friday at the KC Stadium? SHould be a good match since they are both at the top of the qualifying group with equal points.

5-1 would be nice :)

[Nuclear Spoon]

0-0 Half time. My God England are playing shit. Some good shots from Lampard, some good saves from the Azzy keeper, but the highlight of tonight is:
He (robinson) didn't hardly do anything
:D

[jonffm]

We're not playing shite, we're finishing shite. There's a difference. Nothing wrong with the build up at all. You wouldn't be saying we're doing shit if three of four of them had gone in, and just because they didn't, it doesn't mean it goes from a good preformance to a crap one.

We should net a good four in the second half. Their keeper is truly awfull, and we've been very unlucky at times..at others, it was just very amateur finishing...especially that last one from Owen...my god.

The Beckham booking was rather silly.

[Nuclear Spoon]

1-0 Gerrard, woo!

[dogincognito]

Anyone else read the Azerbaijan manages 10 minute rant against Michael Owen? http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y81/richrad/tosser1.gif

[Thomp]

Yeh, that Brazilian knows nothing, I mean he said this: 'Who is this midget? What has he achieved?'

Anywhoo, 2-0. It should have been more, but our finishing was awful, and their keeper...well, punched a lot. Rooney looked energetic, as did Beckham among others. Three points is what's needed though :)

[streety]

What a shower of shite that was...

[Nuclear Spoon]

Dunno why they only put Defoe on in the last 5 minutes. He's hardly going to get any experience that way is he?
Would it really be that risky to start him against a team like Azerbaijan?

[JimmywiT]

I dont think we played all that bad. Kudos must go to Azerbajan they definatly learnt some lessons from thier Poland thrashing. It is true that finishing was sloppy and there was no really superb performances from anyone, but i think it was adaquate, and we got three points.

highlight of the match was Beckam's booking, it was hilarious

[AngryPaul]

Southampton striker Peter Crouch is in line for his first call-up and Tottenham midfielder Michael Carrick could be recalled to the squad.Interesting really.

When ever I think of him I don't think International striker, but considering we will be missing Owen and Rooney, we will be starting with others and it maybe good for him to be there knocking balls down maybe for Defoe.

Anyone else got an opinion?

[dogincognito]

Crouch is a decent shout, but I prefer Ashton myself. I hope he makes it.
Carrick is a quality player, we don't have any other players like him.

The thing is, we'll be playing a "B" team out there but will they ever get another chance? Knowing Sven probbaly not. =/


Edit: Squad just been announced:
Green (Norwich), Carson (Liverpool), James (Manchester City) Campbell (Arsenal), Upson (Birmingham), Brown (Manchester United), G Neville (Manchester United), A Cole (Arsenal), P Neville (Manchester United), Johnson (Chelsea), Jenas (Newcastle), Downing (Middlesbrough), Beckham (Real Madrid), Carrick (Tottenham), J Cole (Chelsea), Hargreaves (Bayern Munich) Wright-Phillips (Manchester City), Smith (Manchester United), Owen (Real Madrid), Crouch (Southampton), A Johnson (Crystal Palace), Defoe (Tottenham).

[AngryPaul]

The thing is, we'll be playing a "B" team out there but will they ever get another chance? Knowing Sven probbaly not. =/That is a point, he is scared to experiment, maybe because the moment an tester goes wrong the whoel media is on his back for poor performance.

Hopefully he could maybe take a young and up-coming squad with him. Maybe with Green, Carson, Upson, Carragher, Wright-Phillips (if he's going), Downing and Lita* included and getting a chance



* - Ok, so thats a bit of Bristol City fanboyism shining through.

EDIT/ *sigh* Not Hargreaves again. Ok, he plays for Bayern Munich but he does not bring anything positive to the England set-up really. The best performance he made in an Englnd shirt was the eight minutes he played against Argentina at the World Cup before getting injured.

[dogincognito]

Very true what you said about the media, even though I'm not a big fan of Sven the media is on his back whatever he does.


Lita? Hardly Leon Knight is he?

[jonffm]

Theres no way Carra could play in the first match, because the fligt out theres on the 26th...a day after the Champs League final...and they need to be home for a parade around Liverpool on the 28th :D

[dogincognito]

The squad for the American tour now:

Green (Norwich), Carson (Liverpool), James (Manchester City) Campbell (Arsenal), Upson (Birmingham), Knight (Fulham), Brown (Manchester United), Young (Charlton Athletic), A Cole (Arsenal), P Neville (Manchester United), Johnson (Chelsea), Jenas (Newcastle), Downing (Middlesbrough), Beckham (Real Madrid), Carrick (Tottenham), J Cole (Chelsea), Hargreaves (Bayern Munich), Richardson (Manchester United), Smith (Manchester United), Owen (Real Madrid), Crouch (Southampton), A Johnson (Crystal Palace), Defoe (Tottenham).


=/

[streety]

I should've got my boots out of the garage. I might have been called up.
Shows how much effort is being put into this tour.

[Boo-Yah]

Graeme Souness got it right for once, the USA tour is pathetic. The only positive that Sven will get from it is looking at fringe players and youngsters for future reference. What is the point? It's been a long season, let everyone rest!

[Nuclear Spoon]

If anyone's read the Sunday Times today, somewhere in the middle is the usual is a review of the season.

Things to make you go errrrm: Zat Knight in the England team
Thing to make Kieran Richardson go errrrm: Kieran Richardson in the England team

Bryan Robson is also the best and worse managerial appointment this season.

[chicken_pie]

david beckham has got himself banned from the last real madrid game, so is expected to be available for all games on the american tour, he did the same thing as he did during the qualifiers, got himself a yellow on purpose, the fool... but anyway, he needs to start proving himself a bit more before he next qualifiers, he played well in the last two, so hopefully these matches will pick up his form even more which is bound to have a positive effect on the rest of the team

and since when is souness right? apart from selling hughes to villa, and hopefully bellamy as well, ayway the players going on the tour can refuse to go, but they want to go to prove themselves for the world cup, if they really wanted to rest they would

[dogincognito]

England team to face USA: James, G Johnson, Brown, Campbell (c), A Cole, J Cole, Jenas, Carrick, Richardson, Crouch, A Johnson.

I think it'll be interesting to see how some of those do. :)

[Nuclear Spoon]

Woohoo for Carrick.

[dogincognito]

Indeed, he's one of the ones I'm glad has a chance.

[chicken_pie]

i think its a good oppurtunity for all of the players with little or no caps, and i think they will easily beat the united states, although columbia im not sure, they do have that amazing player Juan Pablo Angel :p, who plays for a brilliant premiership side. Although seriously on his day he is very good, just a shame he's not on his day very often :rolleyes:

[Nuclear Spoon]

1-0 England already. Kieran Richardson's free kick.

[Thomp]

It's always good to score on your debut :)

[Nuclear Spoon]

2-1, Richardson scored twice. Colombia next, I don't think they'll be as easy.

[AngryPaul]

w00t!!!1

He got the hat-trix0rz!

[Sk£tch]

Sven should be sacked for still refusing to not play David James.

I am getting quite annoyed now

The fucking swedish cunt

[streety]

I was watching France instead :)

Cisse! Cisse! Cisse!

[Nuclear Spoon]

Sven should be sacked for still refusing to not play David James.

I am getting quite annoyed now

The fucking swedish axe-wound

Why? It's nice to give Robbie G a chance anyway, but I'm pissed that he didn't start with Defoe.

Carrick played well, I thought.

[/Zlash/]

The columbians were whinging about every decision made. I found that quite unsporting. Still good game, I think Joe Cole deserves a mention too. He was an influence throughout.

[Disgruntledgoat]

Carrick, a player who everyone seemed to overlook before the tour, but as Alan Hansen kept pointing out - the perfect holding midfielder to shore up England's defence. I don't think he'd make it into the starting line-up, but when we need to get more defensive, Sven might think about putting him on.

Joe Cole settling in very nicely, his place almost assured, just needs to follow up his great form into next season to show it wasn't just fluke.

Kieran Richardson looks a huge prospect for the future.

Peter Crouch - possible squad player, but who does Sven get rid of out of Smith and Defoe?

Also nice to see Owen and Beckham almost as good as they used to be. Owen looking fantastic and Beckham scrapping on the right.

[dogincognito]

Bent replaces Johnson for England

Charlton striker Darren Bent has been called up to the England squad to face Denmark on Wednesday in Copenhagen.

Bent replaces Crystal Palace's Andy Johnson, who has injured a hamstring.

"Andy is injured, we got a late phone call that he has a hamstring injury, so Darren Bent is in," Sven-Goran Eriksson told BBC Radio Five Live's Sportsweek.

Eriksson added that Manchester United's Alan Smith asked not to be included so he could play for the club's reserves, citing a lack of match practice.

Eriksson added: "Alan has had such little football he said he would rather get 90 minutes under his belt on Tuesday for United's reserves."

Bent has been promoted from the Under-21 side and will make his England debut should he feature in Copenhagen.

Birmingham's Matthew Upson has also been called up, with Sol Campbell, Ledley King and Wayne Bridge all injured, while Norwich goalkeeper Robert Green is included.

Injury means that Liverpool's Peter Crouch and Newcastle's Kieron Dyer are both absent but Jermain Defoe, who scored in Tottenham's opening Premiership match against Portsmouth, is in the squad.

Kieran Richardson, who was impressive in England's end-of-season tour of the United States, was selected in the under-21 squad, along with Middlesbrough's Stewart Downing.

That means Michael Carrick, who also performed well in the US, retains his spot among the midfielders.

Eriksson told the FA's website: "We have a very big couple of months ahead of us and we have an important job to do to qualify for the World Cup finals.

"This match against Denmark is the perfect preparation and I'm very much looking forward to the start of what I hope is going to be a very significant season for the England team."

England are second in Group Six, two points behind Poland, who have played one game more.

After facing Wales in Cardiff on 3 September, England's campaign continues in Belfast four days later before the final games against Austria and the Poles in October at Old Trafford.

England squad:
Goalkeepers: Robinson (Tottenham), James (Man City), Green (Norwich)

Defenders: G Neville (Man Utd), G Johnson (Chelsea), A Cole (Arsenal), Ferdinand (Man Utd), Terry (Chelsea), Carragher (Liverpool), Upson (Birmingham)

Midfielders: P Neville (Everton), Beckham (Real Madrid), Gerrard (Liverpool), Lampard (Chelsea), J Cole (Chelsea), Hargreaves (Bayern Munich), Wright-Phillips (Chelsea), Jenas (Newcastle), Carrick (Tottenham)

Strikers: Owen (Real Madrid), Rooney (Man Utd), Defoe (Tottenham), D Bent (Charlton)

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/football/internationals/4140984.stm

What have Phil Neville, Glen Johnson and Jenas done to get in the squad?

Rather have Bent then Johnson, but I'd rather have Heskey than Bent. =/

[Nuclear Spoon]

I'm glad Johnson is out, and Bent looked good on MOTD. I agree with you on the statement on Neville, Johnson and Jenas however. Also happy to see Carrick and Defoe. I imagine King would be in but he's injured for a couple of weeks.

[Chavvy]

THAT WAS A FUCKING DISGRACE

Never in all my 28 years loving and following the game have I seen a worse game as I witnessed tonight. NONE of them deserved to wear the England shirt with pride and I hope Erikson makes them aware of this.

It was embarrassing. :(