Beer

[AverageMan]

This may not apply to everyone here, maybe even nobody, but the subject of real ale is quite important to me. I don't know the situation in other countries so well, but I think the US has an increasing number of small brewers now beginning to compete with the massive brewing coroprations.

At this stage I should probably explain the differences between 'real' and keg ales.

With keg beer, the aim is to produce a product with a long shelf life, which is ready to drink as soon as it leaves the brewery. The conditioning in the brewery is completed, the beer is chilled and filtered to remove all the yeast, and pasteurised to make a sterile product. The beer is put into a sealed metal container, the keg. At the bar, it is usually served branded as smooth, creamy or similar. Real ale is a living fresh beer that undergoes a natural second fermentation in the cask. Like any natural product, the beer will age and go off, and therefore must be drunk within a strict timescale. It requires care in handling on its way to the pub, and care within the pub to bring it to perfection. However, real ale can reach its full flavour potential, without filtration, pasteurisation and added gas. At the bar it is usually served from a tall hand-pump, the beer engine, which requires manual work to raise the beer from the cellar to the glass.

Ever since I have been old enough to legally drink, and even for a few years before I have been interested in real ale. Early experiments into drinking 'household name' lagers left me uninspired; I didn't really understand what was so special about beer as I had been led to believe by my parents. As I aged, and the circle of pubs in which I knew I could get seved widened (remember kids, underage drinking is not only illegal, it's also bad for you :)) I began to taste different beers. My tastes developed further and I became what you would class as an ale drinker. This does not mean that I am an old man with a beard and a permanant cardigan; I'm a 20 year old student. I recently joined CAMRA (http://www.camra.org.uk/)and am now increasing my knowledge of the subject. I'm not against people drinking lager and keg bitter, I just don't see the attraction as far as the drink is concerned.

For the brewer and pub/bar owner the advantages of a pasteurised beer are clear - increased shelf life, no need for a maturation peroid, and it is a simple case of hooking the keg up to a cylinder of gas to serve (the kind of people employed in 'trendy' city center bars just 'cos they look nice can't get it wrong). However these benefits are at the expense of taste in the beer.

From http://www.camra.org.uk

Filtration and pasteurisation remove flavour and character from the product, and pasteurisation adds distinctive flavours of its own - a sort of burnt sugar flavour. These processes also remove the natural carbon dioxide in the beer. In order to make the beer lively, and also to dispense it, the beer is made fizzy with excess carbon dioxide - this gives the beer a distinctive bite. Keg beers are generally served very cold to disguise the taste, or lack of it. Some beers such as Guinness and the so-called nitrokeg beers do not use carbon dioxide alone, but a mix of this and nitrogen gas. This produces a creamier and less fizzy beer, and tends to produce a distinctive head. However nitrokeg beers still undergo the sterilising processes which prevent the beer attaining its full flavour potential. Indeed, nitrogen tends to eliminate bitterness, making for a blander product still.

I can only see one possible advantage of drinking such a beer - the product can be predicted to be the same wherever you go. Again, personally, I'll always try something new wherever I go. The 'it's an authentic foreign product' argument which I have occasionally (actually, rarely) heard, usually based on Stella Artois doesn't hold water - many mass-market lagers are produced to a different, weaker recipe in order to appeal to the British style of drinking.

In many cases, it is the brewers specialising in such ales that keep local pubs running, and to some extent help maintain local community links.

What are your thoughts? Is there anyone who, given the choice, would drink a keg beer rather than a cask version of the same beer? Why?

[Dr-Electro]

I am an old man with a beard and a permanent cardigan. I like real ale much better than simple beers. My grandfather was born in Germany before the turn of the twentieth century. He knew brewing.

I grew up in a family that included everybody from Budweiser (elk piss) drinkers to brew snobs (who just want to make themselves look superior to everybody else). Tastes vary with the individual. On any given day, one person will want something different from the usual, but the rest of the time will drink alcohol that fizzes.

I have had many years in which to experience the rich, full flavor of "live" brews. The simple fact that you can tell with a single sniff if it is ripe or sour is a pleasure in itself.

Drink, be merry and think of me. My physician has forbidden me to ever consume alcohol again. Damned medical doctors, they think they know what's best for everybody. It's worse when they are right, too.

My taste buds remember, though!:D

I have no intention of shaving my back. Having to shave my nose and ears is enough extra work in the morning.

[Beef Magic]

Well, it's a very intresting topic, for that I give you credit.

I'm not a major ale, or indeed Achohol drinker... I know what I like tho, for example, Hobgoblin is a fine ale :D But from the sound of it, Keg's sound better than this cask stuff.

[shaun680]

For me, cost is the only factor :)

[goody 2 shoos]

zzzzzzzzzzzz..... zzzzzzzzzzz..... zzzzzzzzzzz.....

beer? BEER?
what a boring subject
i only have lil bits of beer at a time cuz im only just 17... underage in the u.s
but beer is gross. xept for this one beer in the carribean... i think its called twist.... and it tastes like an exotic kind of iced tea.... mmmmmmmmmmm.....

besides... who wants to get drunk and just keep on vomiting and vomiting??? or pass out... then end up being just plain embaressed that ya drank in the first place??? or get arrest, or killed, cuz you were drunk driving????
OOOOOOHH ME!;)
replace your alcohol with caffeine. theyre both drugs... they both make you bounce off the walls... but caffiene is much better for you, and doesnt usually cause instant death
caffeine is the right way to go:D

william wallace is cool.... but he shouldnt be soooo obsessed with guiness... its bad for ya, bill. and i dont wanna lose you!!:(

[Spoo]

Originally posted by goody 2 shoos
zzzzzzzzzzzz..... zzzzzzzzzzz..... zzzzzzzzzzz.....

beer? BEER?
what a boring subject
i only have lil bits of beer at a time cuz im only just 17... underage in the u.s
but beer is gross. xept for this one beer in the carribean... i think its called twist.... and it tastes like an exotic kind of iced tea.... mmmmmmmmmmm.....

besides... who wants to get drunk and just keep on vomiting and vomiting??? or pass out... then end up being just plain embaressed that ya drank in the first place??? or get arrest, or killed, cuz you were drunk driving????
OOOOOOHH ME!;)
replace your alcohol with caffeine. theyre both drugs... they both make you bounce off the walls... but caffiene is much better for you, and doesnt usually cause instant death
caffeine is the right way to go:D

william wallace is cool.... but he shouldnt be soooo obsessed with guiness... its bad for ya, bill. and i dont wanna lose you!!:(

Do you realy think that was a valid addition to this thread? You cannot even write properly!! Made up words and bad punctuation make you look like an idiot. You obvioulsy haven't read the thread and have decided to just waffle on about rubbish.

Idiot.

Any way on-topic -->

Where my parents live in rural Oxfordshire (UK) most village pubs carry a fine ale made by the Hook Norton brewery as well as other localy brewed ales. Up where i live it's a lot harder to find a pub that sells them. I think as city's continue to swallow up villages as they expand this will be one of the little things in life we will lose.

[TEX_Cougar]

Originally posted by goody 2 shoos

zzzzzzzzzzzz..... zzzzzzzzzzz..... zzzzzzzzzzz.....

beer? BEER?
what a boring subject
i only have lil bits of beer at a time cuz im only just 17... underage in the u.s
but beer is gross. xept for this one beer in the carribean... i think its called twist.... and it tastes like an exotic kind of iced tea.... mmmmmmmmmmm.....

besides... who wants to get drunk and just keep on vomiting and vomiting??? or pass out... then end up being just plain embaressed that ya drank in the first place??? or get arrest, or killed, cuz you were drunk driving????
OOOOOOHH ME!;)



When i first read this thread, i didnt have an opinion on it but i knew somewhere down the line there would be some idiotic childish posts.

Firstly, that carribean stuff isnt beer, its a cocktail or alcopop or something.

2nd, i want to go out and get drunk but i dont keep on vomiting and vomiting and pass out because im mature enough to know when ive had enough to drink.
3rd, i wont get arrested because i dont do $h|t like that when i go out.
4th i might get killed but i doubt it...(above 2 reasons)
and i certainly dont get embarressed when i get drunk because thats what everyone is out for, And i dont drink drive, only idiots do. my sister has lost her liscence twice thru drink driving.
And im sure this applies to a lot of people, not just me. Just because you and your friends might not be able to handle your alcohol, doesnt mean everyone else cant. stick to your twist's, just one though mind you

Ok, sorry about the off topic drawn out post, but it winds me up when i hear stuff like ewwwwwwwwwwwww beer!!!111!1

[Beef Magic]

Originally posted by goody 2 shoos
zzzzzzzzzzzz..... zzzzzzzzzzz..... zzzzzzzzzzz.....

beer? BEER?

besides... who wants to get drunk and just keep on vomiting and vomiting??? or pass out... then end up being just plain embaressed that ya drank in the first place??? or get arrest, or killed, cuz you were drunk driving????
OOOOOOHH ME!;)

william wallace is cool.... but he shouldnt be soooo obsessed with guiness... its bad for ya, bill. and i dont wanna lose you!!:(

This thread is about people who drink ale for the taste, what type of ale they prefer and so on.

Where abouts, can you tell me, does it mention "Well, I get paralitic on beer every night and fight and kill people"

http://www.angelfire.com/alt/crueltobekind/n00b2.jpg

[cadex]

be nice you lot.

[Beef Magic]

Sorry cadex, sonny lad. Have a biscuit.

[Dr-Electro]

I've participated in both beer tastings and wine tastings. I honestly prefer beer to wine. Most wines taste like sour grapes, to me. I just can't make my tongue go al snobby on the viney-stuff.

Beer on the other hand, if done properly, has a taste that just seems to feel at home in my mouth. I have tasted some of the world's finest brews, too. I think my first genuine micro-brewery beer was San Francisco's Anchor Steam Beer. The taste is unique, to say the least.

One thing my beer-discriminating palate has discovered: All of the American beers from the brand-name breweries taste like sour piss. I can't stand the stuff, especially Budweiser and Coors. Lite beer was a stupid idea to start with, too. It tastes even nastier.

So, how do you taste wine? Sniff it. Take a tiny sip and roll it around in your mouth, spit it into a bucket!

How do you taste beer? Take a small sip, let it effervesce (fizz) on your tongue until it "goes flat", swallow. Wait a second for aftertaste, if any. Take a larger sip and savor the flavor. Don't spit out your beer, that is just bad manners.

Ok, spitting wine is bad manners, too, but the French are the idiots who invented wine tasting. What else to expect from the French except bad manners?

[goody 2 shoos]

well basically... this thread's about beer so i wrote my thoughts about beer... so shut up

and be nice, you lot!!;)

[Spoo]

Originally posted by goody 2 shoos
well basically... this thread's about beer so i wrote my thoughts about beer... so shut up

and be nice, you lot!!;)


Actually its a thread about the differences between REAL ALE and KEG BEERS.

If you had read it you would understand that.

I'm not going to be nice to people who write CHOCOLATE LOG FROM A COW because they cant be bothered to read. I maintain that you are an UNDERACHIEVER and deserve everything you get if you are going to continue to post in this thread.

If you dont understand the subject then dont post in the thread.

And learn how to use RUBBERDUCKING punctuation. It doesnt come in three's "..." and "???" just show your lack of understanding for the written word.

Now RUBBERDUCK off and play in beginners.

This post edited and sanitized by some cranky old man.

[Dr-Electro]

EVERYBODY play nice or this thread gets cheesed. It's ok to disagree. It's ok to disagree with passion. It's not ok to be a big baby and act out in print.:angel:

Just write about the beer and try to act intelligent. Punctuation mistakes are excusable, overuse of non-standard punctuation may cause irritation for other forumites.:mad:

Having said that, I am currently looking online for a good home brewing catalog outlet. I may resume making my own suds at home. I was once a fair hand at brewing.

Wish me luck?

[SemiCircle]

call me moron if you will, but when defining keg and cask beers, into which category does bottled ale fall? does it depend on whether the beer in question normally comes from a keg or a cask, as i presume? and what if you cannot get it in pubs (as with the beer below)?

i discovered a strange beer. 'twas a normal, bog-standard ale, but spiked with a hint of ginger. i like ale, and i like ginger, and i liked the combination. very palateable (sp?).

to be honest, i only relatively recently began drinking ale, and mostly because my friends and i were regularly going out to wetherspoons (woo for wetherspoons' cheapness!) every week, and i don't like lager (too fizzy, and don't much like the taste). i tried cider, and prefered ale. i like the general flavour, but haven't yet grown so accustomed to the taste that i can readily distinguish one similar brand from another and make a choice of preference. so i tend to just drink the cheapest, unless i'm in an adventurous mood and am looking to try an alternative in case i prefer it.

which leads me to my point. can anyone give me any tasting notes? what to look for in a good ale, etc.


on a side note: yes most wines taste like bad grapes. however, my dad is something of a (bugger, can't spell the damn french word) in such matters, and hence i have tried some rather better, more expensive wines. if you pay a bit more for your bottle, or know what to look for, then you can get some really great tasting wines. 'tis a very different drink from beer, though.

[AverageMan]

Bottled beers can't really be described as keg or cask as suce though there are a few varieties.

Bottled beers are usually filtered to remove yeast and other sediment, and often have extra CO2 added to keep a reasonable fizz in the brew. However, this CO2 is dissolved as a carbon based acid which can impart a certain acidity to the beer (hardly surprising really). To combat this pour the beer into a glass and try create as large a head as possible. This tends to produce a smoother, more rounded drink. Some canned beers come close to recreating a nitrokeg style beer, (such as Boddingtons or John Smith's smooth) but I'd advise avoiding these.

Bottle Conditioned beers haven't been filtered so are still a live product, much like a cask ale. The bottle will often advise being left to stand and poured carefully to keep any sediment out of your glass, though this is not essential. In my opinion these tend to be better beers but are less commonly available.

In order to develop taste, I'd suggest going along to a beer festival. They have a huge variety of beers usually with tasting notes to guide you in the right direction. It worked for me anyway :)


All of the American beers from the brand-name breweries taste like sour piss. I can't stand the stuff, especially Budweiser and Coors. Lite beer was a stupid idea to start with, too. It tastes even nastier.
Agreed. Same goes for 'ice beer'. It seems to me like fine triumph of marketing over product quality.

Dr. E, good luck with the homebrew. I had a few attempts a while ago but ended up with about 80pints of murky water. :( I'm sure that if you've cracked the art it can't be that difficult to get back into the swing of things. I look forward to hearing how you got on.

[KualaLumpur1997]

In contrast to the second post of this thread, I am not permitted to drink due to my age, but prefer real ales to beers off the production line. Beer tastes like crap. (I don't want any smart-asses making remarks which imply that I know what crap tastes like. Be assured that I do not). Beer is only drunk to get drunk. Ale is the drink of the coinnoseur (sp?). If you walk into any supermarket, they'll sell beer for about 70p($1.10) a pint, but if it's ale you're after, expect to pay £1.50($2.40).

[William Wallace]

Originally posted by goody 2 shoos
zzzzzzzzzzzz..... zzzzzzzzzzz..... zzzzzzzzzzz.....

beer? BEER?
what a boring subject
i only have lil bits of beer at a time cuz im only just 17... underage in the u.s
but beer is gross. xept for this one beer in the carribean... i think its called twist.... and it tastes like an exotic kind of iced tea.... mmmmmmmmmmm.....

besides... who wants to get drunk and just keep on vomiting and vomiting??? or pass out... then end up being just plain embaressed that ya drank in the first place??? or get arrest, or killed, cuz you were drunk driving????
OOOOOOHH ME!;)
replace your alcohol with caffeine. theyre both drugs... they both make you bounce off the walls... but caffiene is much better for you, and doesnt usually cause instant death
caffeine is the right way to go:D

william wallace is cool.... but he shouldnt be soooo obsessed with guiness... its bad for ya, bill. and i dont wanna lose you!!:(

meh. I'm gonna fcuking die anyways, so I'm having my guinness! People who do not like drinking are pansies or GAY!

[Dr-Electro]

Or under strict doctor's orders. Also some are "recovering" alcoholics.

[William Wallace]

Right, right. :p